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Natural or Induced?
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tiompan
tiompan
5758 posts

Re: DNA
Aug 28, 2012, 15:38
Annexus Quam wrote:
Not at all, that was pretty clear, thanks. I was expecting Oppenheimer to be unashamedly slagged off, but Sykes still hasn't had enough time to reach that stage! After all, his results date from a couple of years back.

"This ignores the European dimension where there clearly was a movement of the R1b from the east much later than the immediate post ice age"

That sort of validates Renfrew's IE (post-ice age) theories then. I've heard lots of people in archaeology proudly using his name of late, some even directly affirming the r1b haplogroup are the Indoeuropeans moving into the continent from Anatolia with agriculture, which is, in broad terms, what he suggested some years ago, rebuffed by many.

Pretty exciting times, no doubt, and yet, while some of us try hard to keep (very roughly) up to date with it all, one tends to hear all sorts of racist nonsense. Not wanting to stir things up, but the latest was by a very good friend of mine who got quite worked up when I mentioned to them the celts were no racial entity as such in archaeology (unless a haplogroup is called 'celtic', 'helena' or 'X' or whatever, which is a different matter). The idea of 'celtic', to take two opposite extremes with opposing ideas, varies depending on whether you are from Wales or Italy for example. However, and it must be the legacy left by the Indogermanistik subjects I did, I am a sucker for proto-IE's as a genetic clan though!

Unfortunately, these things just tend to mess things up a bit and make them even more complex, and people in search of clear answers simply switch off and carry on as usual, ie preferring to believe what the media regurgitate.


It looks like R1b may be associated with the Beaker package , recent results from a Beaker grave in Kromsdorf had two males with haplogroup R1b Britain has no Neolithic Y-dna and there is no European Neolithic R1b either but the European Neolithic haplogroups also came from the east .
Lots of reason for optimism as far as I'm concerned on the racial and understanding front .
Although I haven't investigated the PIE /genetic association too deeply a very rough reading suggests there are advances there too .We got rid of Rangers no reason that the c word shouldn't also disappear apart form it's natural fitba home , cue fir drew . Yet to read "The wheel ,the horse , the ?" have you ?
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