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Unsung Forum » Krautrock:The Re-birth of Germany- Youtube taster! |
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Hunter T Wolfe 1706 posts |
Oct 26, 2009, 12:41
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Can were very into the Velvets, too. Also, I remember Lemmy on some radio show saying 'Tomorrow Never Knows' was the start of krautrock. He was roundly dismissed as not knowing what he was talking about, but it transpires that in fact a lot of the German musicians saw that track as the start of something new- a one chord drone, using electronics, effects and tape loops- and used it as a template for what they were trying to do. Lemmy should know what he's talking about as of all the UK bands, Hawkwind probably had the closest link to the 'krautrock' scene, both sonically and with Dave Anderson playing in both the Hawks and Amon Duul II, and writing sleevenotes for the first Neu! LP. They also, like Amon Duul et al, had genuine links to the squat/commune/street revolutionary underground.
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Hunter T Wolfe 1706 posts |
Oct 26, 2009, 12:45
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Popel Vooje wrote: Lord Lucan wrote: Hunter T Wolfe wrote: Seems the German bands have grudgingly come to live with it. Thing is, I reckon whatever the term had been they'd have had objections, because it implies there was a unified alternative scene in Germany at the time, which there certainly wasn't. It was all over the place geographically and a lot of the bands didn't even know of each other's existence at the time. Then if you think of it in terms of definition of a sound, it's not very useful either: Cluster and Amon Duul II or Klaus Schulze and Faust have got fuck-all in common sonically really. It comes down to labelling things and journalists genrefying everything, which has always got up musicians' noses. Pretty much all the German bands of the time really had in common musically was a love of improvisation and a penchant for legnthy 20-minute tracks, and that certainly wasn't unique either to Germany or to rock music at the time (if Miles Davis had been German, "In A Silent Way" and "Bitches' Brew" would probably have been labelled as krautrock, and there are others like the Plastic People of the Universe who weren't German but have clear similarities with some of the Krautrock bands in both sound and attitude). Of all the interviews with German musicians that I've read, the only one to have gone on record as taking exception to the krautrock term was Ralf Hutter. He claimed that it was a purely English idiom and compared it to sauerkraut only ever being sold for, and bought by, English tourists in Germany. I agree- these days 'krautrock' as an influence seems to boil down to just having a generic Neu / Mother Sky motorik beat on your record- the laziness applies ro both journalists and bands. I suppose the common groud is in trying to do something that ISN'T American rock n' roll. Hypnotic, droning one note grooves and the use of electronics and early syhnthesisers seem to be a fairly common denominator, too.
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Monolith Cocktail 173 posts |
Oct 26, 2009, 12:48
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Yes the Faust part was a highlight though I felt they were playing up to the film crew a bit. Amon Duul II was great to see but all too brief, also Popal Vuh was almost brushed aside. They should have attempted to make a two parter on krautrock instead of just one hour show. They also concentrated too much on Kraftwerk. Dom.
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Jim Tones 5142 posts |
Oct 26, 2009, 14:45
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Stevo wrote: his music show Revolver was pretty good too. I thought the 'theme' and format was great, a disgruntled old club owner forced to 'get with the times' to get the crowds and money in (quite ironic as it didn't last long!)
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IanB 6761 posts |
Edited Oct 26, 2009, 19:19
Oct 26, 2009, 19:04
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Moon Cat wrote: One thing that struck me was just how genteel and polite the various artists interviewed were. When you think how in yer face and 'tudey we expect a lot of our rock stars to be, it was quite refreshing to see these soft-spoken folk reminiscing. People who have long term kudos but who have never really had hit records tend to view their work and the world a little differently I think. It's a less competitive and less status oriented trip so they tend to be a bit less full-on.
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Popel Vooje 5373 posts |
Edited Jul 22, 2010, 16:29
Oct 27, 2009, 15:16
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Hunter T Wolfe wrote: Popel Vooje wrote: Lord Lucan wrote: Hunter T Wolfe wrote: Seems the German bands have grudgingly come to live with it. Thing is, I reckon whatever the term had been they'd have had objections, because it implies there was a unified alternative scene in Germany at the time, which there certainly wasn't. It was all over the place geographically and a lot of the bands didn't even know of each other's existence at the time. Then if you think of it in terms of definition of a sound, it's not very useful either: Cluster and Amon Duul II or Klaus Schulze and Faust have got fuck-all in common sonically really. It comes down to labelling things and journalists genrefying everything, which has always got up musicians' noses. Pretty much all the German bands of the time really had in common musically was a love of improvisation and a penchant for legnthy 20-minute tracks, and that certainly wasn't unique either to Germany or to rock music at the time (if Miles Davis had been German, "In A Silent Way" and "Bitches' Brew" would probably have been labelled as krautrock, and there are others like the Plastic People of the Universe who weren't German but have clear similarities with some of the Krautrock bands in both sound and attitude). Of all the interviews with German musicians that I've read, the only one to have gone on record as taking exception to the krautrock term was Ralf Hutter. He claimed that it was a purely English idiom and compared it to sauerkraut only ever being sold for, and bought by, English tourists in Germany. I agree- these days 'krautrock' as an influence seems to boil down to just having a generic Neu / Mother Sky motorik beat on your record- the laziness applies ro both journalists and bands. I suppose the common groud is in trying to do something that ISN'T American rock n' roll. Hypnotic, droning one note grooves and the use of electronics and early syhnthesisers seem to be a fairly common denominator, too. That's true, but I think a lot of the hypnotic, one chord grooves came reflected the influence of the New York underground scene at the time - Tony Conrad & Faust's "Outside the Dream Syndicate" providing the most obvious missing link between ther two scenes. There were US rock bands experimenting with early synthesizers too (like the United States of America and Fifty Foot Hose), although only Silver Apples integrated them into their music to the same extent as Tangerine Dream or Cluster. Aslo, as Stevo says below, I always heard s strong West Coast psych influence on both Amon Duuls, although (again) they captured the more free-flowing elements of that scene on record rather than just onstage - so I'm not sure how un-American their aesthetic really was in the cold light of day Plus, if you look beyond the 1st dicvision stuff that's actually remembered, the German music scene was just as chock full of derivative prog/jazz/fusion twaddle as Britain's or America's at the time (one listen to Kraan, Embryo or Birth Control confirms this for me, although someone more prog-friendly than me will probably defend them...)
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dodge one 1242 posts |
Oct 27, 2009, 15:20
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Venus in Furs, anyone?
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Popel Vooje 5373 posts |
Oct 27, 2009, 15:22
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dodge one wrote: Venus in Furs, anyone? Indeed. You can't overestimate the Velvets' influence on Can or Neu! And I believe at least three of the VU grew up on Long Island just like yourself too...
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dodge one 1242 posts |
Oct 27, 2009, 15:25
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Yup....and thanks for noticing!
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Lonesome Cowboy Bill 356 posts |
Oct 27, 2009, 15:41
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I was excited on the lead up to watching this, found some parts interesting, some parts dull. All in all a pretty good documentary but I can't imagine it'll make me stretch out beyond my Can, Neu!, La Dusseldorf, Cluster and Harmonia records. Faust were poop. I find it hard to be entertained or interested by the playing of a cement mixer and broom.....or whatever else is lying around. Re: Tago Mago and Ege Bamyasi - does anyone enjoy listening to Aumgn, Peking O and Soup? I love the rest of those albums but those tracks are terrible. Just wondered where others stand on the far out reaches of 'Krautrock'.
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