Moon Cat
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Re: leaping lemmings
Jan 09, 2003, 20:18
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ah
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Merrick
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Freeganism
Jan 10, 2003, 22:03
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This stuff all depends on your reasons for not eating animals.
Most of the reasons are to do with the laws of supply and demand (if you don't buy it then they won't make as much). Thus, anything that is being thrown away anyway is irrelevant to this and so fair game. This idea is known as freeganism (vegan unless it's free, basically).
There are several reasons why I'm a vegan but not a freegan. Firstly, after all the reasons of animal welfare and land use and whatnot, I also have the reason of not wanting dead animals in me. Even if I wasn't encouraging it, I'd still be very aware of the suffering that was involved in making that meat, and I'd be very miserable eating it.
Secondly, the usual reason animal produce is available to freegans is cos it's being thrown away. This commonly means it's out of date or been kept unrefrigerated. Very bad poisonous things can happen to such animal produce, and I ain't risking that food poisoning.
However, I have total respect for freegans. There are loads of us in Leeds who get food out of the skips at the back of supermarkets and wholesalers, and there's often animal produce there. I fully understand those who see it as adding some value to the food, to at least make the suffering involved in making that salami or caviar not have been entirely in vain. If not taken and eaten, it would waste resources to take it to a landfill site where it'd be a methane-producer.
Oh and aqk, freeganism does include roadkill. I remember folks at Bagnor camp at the Newbury Bypass campaign eating loads of it.
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Merrick
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Re: Stella Artois is not Vegetarian
Jan 10, 2003, 22:17
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I've loked into this a bit now, and it seems you're right - the clearing agents bind the dead yeast together and make it all sink to the bottom of the brewing vessel. The cleared beer/wine is then siphoned off. So there's no actual animal product in the stuff you drink (unless it's wine with dried blood added). Still, morally it has to count - I'm sure the animal whose guts and bones are used is just as dead whether or not we metabolise the product or not.
This is indeed pretty much the same deal as much of organic farming where bone, blood and fish meal is used. Some farmers are going over to 'veganic' production, using no animal produce.
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a23
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Re: Stella Artois is not Vegetarian
Jan 13, 2003, 15:41
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Thanks, Merrick - I have wondered about that for a while. I think it is a really difficult area - because there are just some things you can never be sure of how they were produced. It's like all these products that have say milk products hidden away under "flavourings" and you can never know unless you write to the company (assuming they're not in the animal free shopper - which is often the case).
I'm trying to be reasonably sensible about what I eat at home, (where I can check the contents more closely) and a bit more relaxed when eating out - i had my first egg in 2.5 years over the weekend and I didn't die. But i don't plan to make a habit of it - and to be honest, though we were away at a top class hotel for the weekend I much prefer dining out at our local vegan paradise in Glasgow...
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YerArseInParsley
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Re: leaping lemmings
Jan 13, 2003, 17:22
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But the general point is good. My mate Rob was the most commited vegan I've met. Endless nights watching ALF videos of pigs being blow-torched etc, marvellous vegan dinners, the works. He worked at NCDL and one of their dogs got loose and attacked a passing deer. Rob lifted the deer back to the dog pound to be treated, but it died in his arms on the way back. So for the first and only time, he ate venison. He turned down road kill once, when the driver in front of him ran down 4 baby geese - mainly because he was convinced the driver hit them deliberately. As he always said regarding meat, everyone has lines that they won't cross.
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pebblesfromheaven
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Re: Freeganism
Jan 13, 2003, 18:26
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Yeah, sounds like being a freegan is the healthiest way to be?!?! I'm speechless. Do people really eat food from skips using the justification that it's ok cos it's waste? Bloody hell.
Just out of interest, what is the average life expectancy of a freegan?
And what happen if they got major food poisoning, damaged a major organ eg pancreas, and had to inject pigs' insulin? Just wondering...?
.o0O0o.
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dizzyfarie
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Re: Stella Artois is not Vegetarian
Jan 13, 2003, 22:50
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damn it, i h8 cider bt as a tru vege i suppoe i shud join th legions of drunks and 12-17 yr old scallys and get th cids in!
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YerArseInParsley
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Why don't vegans eat honey ?
Jan 13, 2003, 23:29
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I know bees make the honey for other reasons, but they aren't actually harmed by the process are they, more sort of exploited. Unless I'm wrong about that I see honey more as a 'insects workers rights' issue.
I dunno why we spend so much time wiping out perfectly cuddly pretty species and we never try to exterminate the midge. I asked a local environmentalist what role the midge plays in the ecosphere and they said 'A most important role - they keep the english tourist away'. Now while I'm no fan of english tourists, I prefer 'em to midges and so have been placing bat-boxes with my neice whereever I can. ( Bats eat their own body weight in midges everyday ).
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necropolist
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Re: Is it OK for veges to eat policemen?
Jan 14, 2003, 10:21
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i wrote an articxle for our philosophy society magazine when i was at uni asking the abpove question.
eventually i decided it was, based loosely upon the following logic:
Eating sentient beings is wrong
Policemen qua policemen are merely automotons acting on behalf of the state, and have no brain of their own to use, and hence are not sentient
It is therefore acceptaqble to eat policement - but only if they have been killed whilst on duty.
For some reason they chose npot to publish it - tho they did do my proof of the non-existence of god
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Zastrozzi
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Re: Is it OK for veges to eat penguins
Jan 14, 2003, 11:29
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Yes - it contains lethal levels of vitamin A, would you believe.
However, this does beg the question:
a) why would you want to eat the liver if you've (presumably) got the entire corpse to choose from?
b) why were they taught this in Egypt?
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