thesweetcheat
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Re: How is Rock Art aged?/Cupmarks
Dec 17, 2012, 20:28
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The "cup" on the cairn stone is probably 4"-5" across (that's from sketchy memory though).
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Harryshill
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Re: How is Rock Art aged?
Dec 17, 2012, 20:29
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Don't agree with that.
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bladup
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Edited Dec 17, 2012, 20:30
Re: How is Rock Art aged?
Dec 17, 2012, 20:29
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tiompan wrote: bladup wrote: Sanctuary wrote: thesweetcheat wrote: Lots of these patterns (particularly spirals, zig zags and chevrons) appear in the edges of message pads when people doodle while on the phone/in meetings. I'm not sure that most of the people are taking hallucinogens at work (I could be wrong), so isn't an equally plausible explanation that these are the sort of patterns people make when decorating things?
Hell of a doodle in stone eh. Can you imagine the phone bill for a three week call :-)
Ha, a lot of stone tools could have been sharpened in the process of making the rock art as well, these people did like killing two birds with one stone [3 or 4 if they could], making art and at the same time stone tools sounds good to me.
The creation of rock art tends to result in the dulling of points not sharpening .
Rubbing tools [and various other tools] need dulling before use and rock art is made in various ways, as you well know.
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thesweetcheat
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Re: How is Rock Art aged?
Dec 17, 2012, 20:30
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I wasn't talking about mushrooms though (I wouldn't even begin to try and tell an expert such as you anything about that), I was talking about possible reasons why people decorate things.
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tiompan
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Re: How is Rock Art aged?
Dec 17, 2012, 20:30
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thesweetcheat wrote: How does offering an alternative explanation to use of hallucinogens make me "clearly out of my depth"?
Not sure that it's possible to have any kind of discussion unless other explanations are considered as being as equally (or more) plausible as your own theory. Or is your conclusion that every human activity involving applying patterns to a surface can only be a result of use of hallucinogens?
The days of a drugs as an explanation for rock art in Britain and particularly Ireland were in early 90 's , it has had it's day and evry if any few researchers accept it these days ,for obvious reasons .
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tjj
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Re: How is Rock Art aged?/Cupmarks
Dec 17, 2012, 20:32
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tiompan wrote: Sanctuary wrote: Sanctuary wrote: Two questions for our experts. Is it possible to 'age' unrecorded rock art and at the same time differentiate between two distinct periods (age) of art on the same rock?
After 86 posts and about 80 being totally irrelevent to the thread, may I, in an attempt to stabilise things ask a further question that hopefully we can all join in sensibly. Sorry if that sounds patronising but it's not meant to be.
Cupmarks. To my untrained eye, many of them look 'natural'. How do you tell the difference between those and the 'manufactured' ones?
Roy , quite , and not patronising .I posted this a wee while ago .Might help .
http://www.themodernantiquarian.com/site/14271/non_rock_art.html
That is a really helpful link Tiompan. When I first heard about cup marks I started looking for them locally but learnt (from you) that rock art rarely occurs on sarsen because it is so hard. I got quite excited about this stone in a local village (near M4). I don't know if you recall me asking you about it but appreciated the benefit of your expertise.
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bladup
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Edited Dec 17, 2012, 20:32
Re: How is Rock Art aged?
Dec 17, 2012, 20:32
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thesweetcheat wrote: I wasn't talking about mushrooms though (I wouldn't even begin to try and tell an expert such as you anything about that), I was talking about possible reasons why people decorate things.
Yes my answer was it's deep rooted into our brains because our ancesters tripped so much.
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thesweetcheat
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Re: How is Rock Art aged?
Dec 17, 2012, 20:33
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bladup wrote: thesweetcheat wrote: I wasn't talking about mushrooms though (I wouldn't even begin to try and tell an expert such as you anything about that), I was talking about possible reasons why people decorate things.
Yes my answer was it's deep rooted into our brains because our ancesters tripped so much.
Or not. You have your theory, I don't have to accept it.
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tiompan
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Re: How is Rock Art aged?
Dec 17, 2012, 20:34
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bladup wrote: tiompan wrote: bladup wrote: thesweetcheat wrote: Lots of these patterns (particularly spirals, zig zags and chevrons) appear in the edges of message pads when people doodle while on the phone/in meetings. I'm not sure that most of the people are taking hallucinogens at work (I could be wrong), so isn't an equally plausible explanation that these are the sort of patterns people make when decorating things?
and why do people decorate things?, the images seem deep rooted into the brain itself, people "tranced" out doodling do the same designs, people see the same designs with migraines, from fasting and meditation and when your trippin, which do you think they were doing at the great stone circles and chambered cairns??? do it at the sites and then you'll know yourself...
All the motifs found in passage grves and rock art are the same as found in the doodles of non drugged adults and children ,here is no need to infer meditaion , stress , deprivation ,drugs , any form of extrem asc , these motifs are the common inheritance of all humans . On the other hand look at the motifs drawn by people who are drugged ,regardless whether synthetic or organic , suffering from sleep depriavtion , hunger and they are cover a huge spectrum of motifs and are not limited to the relatively small number of motifs found in rock art .
Trip at the sites and they make a lot more sense, and when you do the gap between you and the ancients is almost non existent, they sometimes even stand with you.
You seem to forget this has been done many times , probably before you were born , great fun , but just as Bach sounds great whilst tripping we appreciate that he wasnt' when he wrote the stuff , although some people are still convinced he was .
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bladup
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Re: How is Rock Art aged?
Dec 17, 2012, 20:37
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tiompan wrote: thesweetcheat wrote: How does offering an alternative explanation to use of hallucinogens make me "clearly out of my depth"?
Not sure that it's possible to have any kind of discussion unless other explanations are considered as being as equally (or more) plausible as your own theory. Or is your conclusion that every human activity involving applying patterns to a surface can only be a result of use of hallucinogens?
The days of a drugs as an explanation for rock art in Britain and particularly Ireland were in early 90 's , it has had it's day and evry if any few researchers accept it these days ,for obvious reasons .
They knew in the early 90's because nearly everyone my age was off there heads, that's why they knew then, ending up at these places in those states, the places make the most sense then, i was at castlerigg once when half a rave turned up, even cope used to jokenly call Avebury - Ravebury.
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