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Jesus I despise Brexit.
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giNgko_C
giNgko_C
1618 posts

Ah yeah
Dec 04, 2018, 19:35
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsaA903oxvc

carckin' met

Cx
Captain Starlet
Captain Starlet
1093 posts

Re: Jesus I despise Brexit.
Dec 04, 2018, 19:57
I'm not surprised they're doing so badly to be honest. Labour in Wales are basically tory mouthpieces and people are getting very fed up with them. Across the uk, Corbyn isn't trusted, which is hardly surprising as one of many consensuses are is that he's never once stood up for the uk, so how can he be trusted to lead a country he's never supported in people's eyes?

In comparison with the shower that the tories are, Labour should be walking through the polls with ease, and I genuinely believe that for the most part, the reason for that is an appalling front bench and useless leader who only supports causes he's personally interested in with little to no regard for anyone else. The People's vote march was a prime example which saw him lose a lot of support for his repeated conspicuous absence!

With the polls I really have no idea why Corbyn is repeatedly droning on about a GE that he's not going to win. I think his ego is getting the better of him over actual reality, but then he's just a part of the Westminster bubble now so not really a shock, but if Labour want a shot at a GE they've got to ditch Corbyn. I was genuinely surprised while I was still a labour member how genuinely hated he really is!
thesweetcheat
thesweetcheat
6102 posts

Re: Jesus I despise Brexit.
Dec 04, 2018, 20:00
nigelswift wrote:
"gets rid of:
(a) likelihood of no-deal (because MPs won't vote for it) and
(b) excuses that we have to leave because the EU won't "let us" change our mind now"

And for that reason she's switched from "my way or hard Brexit" to "my way or Remain" which is exactly what a second Ref ought to be asking. I think the hard men are going to have to find something pretty special.


Yep, it's both fascinating to watch unfold and utterly horrifying that it's come to this.
giNgko_C
giNgko_C
1618 posts

Edited Dec 04, 2018, 20:39
Re: Jesus I despise Brexit.
Dec 04, 2018, 20:30
I think it's brilliant, speaking as an idiot, because it tests the legal structure by having a Nigel Farage as an MEP in the first place, though much like the Matrix sequels Nigel Farage has found a way of cloning himself and it's up to Keanu Reeves who is Jesus to sacrifice himself on the altar of the closer political onion.

Because in my febrile disengaged nonsense brain I would say social order is an iterative process of testing and retesting, and gross misrepresentation by actors with contracts.

So when Liz Truss appears quoted on Twitter very loudly and Jacob Rees Mogg keeps spouting the bollocks Infowars 1776 line it's because the goverment is being held hostage by nutters your are all already accutely aware of.

Cx
thesweetcheat
thesweetcheat
6102 posts

Re: Jesus I despise Brexit.
Dec 04, 2018, 20:47
Yes to all of that. The Liz Truss thing made me laugh, she was quoted as saying she wanted to "embrace the chaos" so maybe she is in tune with the zeitgeist. Or something.
PMM
PMM
3155 posts

Re: Jesus I despise Brexit.
Dec 06, 2018, 02:43
thesweetcheat wrote:
although I still doubt Labour would win a majority at present, their vacillating over which position to take on Brexit will have put a lot of people off.


They haven't vacillated. They have been consistently ambiguous. I think this reflects both that the Labour Party has moved to the left, and that this change is anything but uniform.

Who are they for? Originally, as I understand things, they were created as a workers and trades union movement, but were always a broad church. That breadth created internal tensions and power struggles over ideology. It has always drawn its following from a mix of the politicised working class and the progressive middle class. These groups have different agendas, and much of the vote for Brexit came from working class areas, to the continued bafflement and bemusement of many, while most of the push towards remain tended to come from the more cosmopolitan urban centres.

I suspect without the freak dynamic that led to Corbyn becoming leader, the Labour Party would have quickly aligned itself firmly in the Remain camp, partly because of political opportunism, but mainly because that's where it was and who it was for. The working class, the strongholds would vote for them anyway.

Yet Corbyn did become leader, and the forces that pushed him into that position have also been at work at every level of the Labour Party's organisational structure. Those forces have to be recognised. With a currently engaged grass roots pushing for deselections and changes to the political balance of the Labour Party's core structures, some of the changes being wrought will last for a good few years, although I think the wave of Corbyn-Mania has probably crested.

If the Labour Party has moved towards the working class, and the working class wants Brexit, it has a mandate, no matter how ill judged that mandate may be.

The question is of course, Why did so many of the hoi polloi vote for it in the first place? I'm not entirely convinced that half the country are gullible or racist or both.
nigelswift
8065 posts

Re: Jesus I despise Brexit.
Dec 06, 2018, 07:09
"I'm not entirely convinced that half the country are gullible or racist or both."

Of course not, but 4% are and that has been enough to swing it and even now May is addressing them in particular.
Captain Starlet
Captain Starlet
1093 posts

Re: Jesus I despise Brexit.
Dec 06, 2018, 07:21
I agree that if Corbyn hadn't been elected leader then labour would be firmly remain, the unfortunate point is is that Corbyn is rather anti-EU, remember he was the one saying A50 should be sent immediately on the day after the ref. This has created a huge level of confusion within labour who don't really know which side they're supposed to be representing (Remain or leave). This confusion has cost Labour a large number of potential votes and supporters.

During the last People's Vote march, Corbyn conveniently managed to send himself off to Geneva for a jolly. The post he made on Twitter on the day of the march telling people what he was doing was met with a great number of responses, all of them shunning him for not even being in the country to represent the largest movement in the country since the Iraq march.

Also there's the point that 86% of Labour members support remain, or a People's Vote. Corbyn is also ignoring them with his lack of support, although he promised to do otherwise with regard to members.

All polls online still point to the tories winning a GE, a large reason for this, I personally believe, is labour's lack of direction and support over leaving the EU.
nigelswift
8065 posts

May's latest big fib
Dec 06, 2018, 09:40
"Some people say take No Deal off the table but the only way to do that is to have A deal".

Nope.
giNgko_C
giNgko_C
1618 posts

Re: Jesus I despise Brexit.
Dec 08, 2018, 23:44
have you been to East Anglia recently?
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