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The Modern Antiquarian Forum » A Very British Witchcraft |
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Littlestone 5386 posts |
Aug 14, 2013, 18:33
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A bit OT but might be of interest - A Very British Witchcraft, presented by Ronald Hutton - “The extraordinary story of Britain's fastest-growing religious group - the modern pagan witchcraft of Wicca - and of its creator, an eccentric Englishman called Gerald Gardner. “Historian and leading expert in Pagan studies Professor Ronald Hutton explores Gardner's story and experiences first-hand Wicca's growing influence throughout Britain today.” More4 on Saturday, 17 August at 9pm. Details here .
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Wild Wooder 216 posts |
Aug 14, 2013, 20:47
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Being Prof Hutton, we may reasonably expect a fairly balanced view. Although that, of course, depends on how much the BBC wants to sensationalise it! Let's hope not. Ratings is all! but fingers crossed.
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Littlestone 5386 posts |
Aug 18, 2013, 11:58
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Excellent prog by Prof Hutton introducing British Wicca (Britain's fastest-growing religious group) and the man (Gerald Gardner) who lit the spark that set it going. My respect and admiration for Prof Hutton ever grows; always erudite and articulate, with never a trace of arrogance or ‘I know better’. Gentle and warm, always respectful and receptive to the views of others (no matter how far away from ‘the norm’ they might be). He ends the programme with the words, “Whereas other faiths say, this is what you should feel about the divine, [Wicca] says, this is how you can feel divine.” Can be caught again here.
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tjj 3606 posts |
Edited Aug 19, 2013, 00:49
Aug 19, 2013, 00:24
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Just watched that. Thank you for posting the link. My understanding of 'ancient' witchcraft is that it was the practice of herbalism, healing and midwifery undertaken mainly by women - and that they were often persecuted/murdered by the male dominated, power based Church in past centuries. It is possible that the knowledge of herbs was sometimes misused, either by accident or design, as many are poisonous. Although I like Ronald Hutton a lot, much of this programme made me feel uncomfortable. In some ways its content has a place in the history of 20th century culture and seems an anachronism in today's world. Although 'Wicca' is still widely practised in the form described in the programme it seems to me (and this is a personal opinion) as delusional as any other religion. Reverence for nature exists by itself for many people - who don't need to join or cult, sect or religion to pursue it. One thing I did notice was that an illustration in Gerald Gardner's rare 'Book of Shadows' bore a remarkable similarity to the 'Foxhill Hill Figure' discussed on another thread. Could there be a link I wonder.
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Mustard 1043 posts |
Aug 19, 2013, 10:00
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tjj wrote: My understanding of 'ancient' witchcraft is that it was the practice of herbalism, healing and midwifery undertaken mainly by women - and that they were often persecuted/murdered by the male dominated, power based Church in past centuries. It is possible that the knowledge of herbs was sometimes misused, either by accident or design, as many are poisonous. Well that's certainly one interpretation. The reality is though, like with much of history, we simply don't know. We don't even know whether "witchcraft" existed in the sense of a consistent set of beliefs and practices. tjj wrote: Although 'Wicca' is still widely practised in the form described in the programme it seems to me (and this is a personal opinion) as delusional as any other religion. Reverence for nature exists by itself for many people - who don't need to join or cult, sect or religion to pursue it. Precisely.
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Sanctuary 4670 posts |
Aug 19, 2013, 10:20
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tjj wrote: Reverence for nature exists by itself for many people - who don't need to join or cult, sect or religion to pursue it. Yep, that's me!
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tjj 3606 posts |
Aug 19, 2013, 10:29
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Mustard wrote: tjj wrote: My understanding of 'ancient' witchcraft is that it was the practice of herbalism, healing and midwifery undertaken mainly by women - and that they were often persecuted/murdered by the male dominated, power based Church in past centuries. It is possible that the knowledge of herbs was sometimes misused, either by accident or design, as many are poisonous. Well that's certainly one interpretation. The reality is though, like with much of history, we simply don't know. We don't even know whether "witchcraft" existed in the sense of a consistent set of beliefs and practices. Thank you for you comment Mustard, always appreciated. I may be wrong (I often am) but I thought that whilst we don't know for certain witchcraft and magic were practised as a 'set of beliefs' we do know that the knowledge and practice of herbal healing (and poisoning for that matter) was often condemned as witchcraft. The programme 'A Very British Witchcraft' seemed more about Occultism which was alive and well around London when I lived there with bookshops such as Atlantis and Skoob (then near the British Museum) as meeting places. I had a close friend who worked at Skoob and my first ever visit to Avebury and Wayland's Smithy was because there was a spare seat going on the coach trip from London. I always respect other people's beliefs if genuinely held but when someone (as happened on that occasion) starts talking about bringing on the demise of an adversary by casting spells in their direction - I did not want to know, then or now.
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Mustard 1043 posts |
Aug 19, 2013, 10:40
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tjj wrote: Thank you for you comment Mustard, always appreciated. I may be wrong (I often am) but I thought that whilst we don't know for certain witchcraft and magic were practised as a 'set of beliefs' we do know that the knowledge and practice of herbal healing (and poisoning for that matter) was often condemned as witchcraft. I think that's a reasonable supposition. It's human nature to beat people with whatever stick is available. tjj wrote: The programme 'A Very British Witchcraft' seemed more about Occultism which was alive and well around London when I lived there with bookshops such as Atlantis and Skoob (then near the British Museum) as meeting places. I had a close friend who worked at Skoob and my first ever visit to Avebury and Wayland's Smithy was because there was a spare seat going on the coach trip from London. I always respect other people's beliefs if genuinely held but when someone (as happened on that occasion) starts talking about bringing on the demise of an adversary by casting spells in their direction - I did not want to know, then or now. I don't respect beliefs. I respect the people who hold them - if that respect is earned. I dabbled in paganism when I was younger, and I've always felt an affinity with native British mythology and culture (such as we know of it), and the landscape resonates with me in a way that I'd describe as spiritual. Of all the different spiritual practitioners that I've met, however, the ones whose personal ethics, morality, sincerity, conviction and self-sacrifice have impressed me the most have been Christians. Go figure.
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moss 2897 posts |
Aug 19, 2013, 10:56
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I must admit my thoughts on witch crafts have always been 'coloured' by reading Dennis Wheatley at a young age in the 60s. Black magic, horned gods, pentagrams and sacrificial young maidens 'deflowered' ;) and so I had to readjust my thinking to Wicca, and consult the dictionary as to what it meant. So Gardner took an old word and rendered it into his version of witchcraft, and no doubt with a certain wicked cackle, did you not notice the antlered crown on the table in Spain, the Great God Pan has appeared, rampaging around in his usual fertile manner ;) and the phallic knives used for drawing the patterns on the ground, scepticism reared its ugly head but then he could have been genuine. In fact this was a history of an eccentric man, and Ronald Hutton did an excellent historic profile and I have never read anything on Wiccan so who am I to judge? But the word 'paganism' is the one I prefer and relate to in a modern way and perhaps the love of nature and the need to protect our environment, the healing process lies at the bottom of this 'new age' thinking... "Thanks to Wheatley, people “knew” what Black Magic and Satanism – historically an almost non-existent phenomenon – were like. Professor Jean La Fontaine made an astute link to Wheatley-derived imagery in her debunking of the Satanic Ritual Abuse panic, and Ronald Hutton, in The Triumph of the Moon, remembers adolescents borrowing “risqué imagery” from Wheatley’s books to decorate parties: “For my generation of Essex teenagers, they represented the essential primer in diabolism.”. http://www.forteantimes.com/features/articles/2623/the_devil_rides_out.html
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Mustard 1043 posts |
Aug 19, 2013, 11:25
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moss wrote: ...and perhaps the love of nature and the need to protect our environment, the healing process lies at the bottom of this 'new age' thinking... Be nice to think that, eh? Sadly, the "my other car is a broomstick" and similar bumper stickers on gas-guzzling Chelsea tractors have left me a little cynical. No doubt there's an element of truth in what you say, but then a desire for peace and harmony probably lay at the bottom of early Christianity, and look how that ended up.
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