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Astralcat 742 posts |
Jul 31, 2013, 15:21
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Evergreen Dazed wrote: Astralcat wrote: Evergreen Dazed wrote: Astralcat wrote: Glastonbury IS a chakra! To illustrate the utter pointlessness of this kind of assertion, i'll just say "No it isn't" and that I know that 3000 years ago it was covered in banana and cream trifle. You won't shift me from that belief. Its my life illusion, metaphysical, garden gnomic view. I wouldn't try to and completely respect your point of view. Om Shanti. (psst: yes it is!) Its a fact - 3000 years ago Glastonbury Tor was covered in bits of banana. Thank you for respecting the truth. Hari Om.
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Mustard 1043 posts |
Jul 31, 2013, 15:22
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Astralcat wrote: Mustard wrote: Astralcat wrote: How can you prove something that exists within its own framework entirely beyond the limited boundaries of materialistic science etc ? You can't. That's why these things are personal beliefs rather than fact.Astralcat wrote: Anything in the psychic, metaphysical, spiritual or 'occult' realms is eminently provable as fact within its own terms by those experienced to any degree of operating within them. "Within its own terms"? Seriously... this is almost exactly what Christians say about Jesus. "He must exist, because I have experienced him. I can prove he exists, because if you invite him into your life, you will experience him too". If you can't empirically prove something, it isn't a fact - it's a belief. Astralcat wrote: Glastonbury is a chakra in this respect, as it opens and helps develop individual spiritual energetic progression for those who want to work with its existing extremey powerful energy force. I disagree. Having lived here for the best part of 20 years, my experience of Glastonbury has been quite the opposite. I've lost count of the number of druids, priestesses and pilgrims of various spiritual persuasions who spout similar stuff about the place, and turn out to be thieves, bullies and violent misogynists (I'm not suggesting that this applies to you). You obviously met the wrong people. There are bullshitters and no good types in every field of human existence. They're easily spotted in this particular context and easily ignored and avoided. After 20 years, I think I can safely say that I've met a fairy representative cross-section of the Glastonbury spiritual community, and I have yet to see the faintest bit of evidence that Glastonbury offers "spiritual energetic progression" in a different way to any other place. You are of course free to believe differently, but that will remain a belief rather than a fact.
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Mustard 1043 posts |
Jul 31, 2013, 15:23
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Astralcat wrote: Subjective personal experience is fact. No it isn't. If I hallucinate a purple elephant, it doesn't mean that there's a purple elephant standing in front of me.
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Mustard 1043 posts |
Jul 31, 2013, 15:24
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Evergreen Dazed wrote: Astralcat wrote: Evergreen Dazed wrote: Astralcat wrote: Glastonbury IS a chakra! To illustrate the utter pointlessness of this kind of assertion, i'll just say "No it isn't" and that I know that 3000 years ago it was covered in banana and cream trifle. You won't shift me from that belief. Its my life illusion, metaphysical, garden gnomic view. I wouldn't try to and completely respect your point of view. Om Shanti. (psst: yes it is!) Its a fact - 3000 years ago Glastonbury Tor was covered in bits of banana. Thank you for respecting the truth. No it wasn't! It was apples! *starts religious war* ;)
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Astralcat 742 posts |
Edited Jul 31, 2013, 15:25
Jul 31, 2013, 15:24
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Mustard wrote: Astralcat wrote: Mustard wrote: Astralcat wrote: How can you prove something that exists within its own framework entirely beyond the limited boundaries of materialistic science etc ? You can't. That's why these things are personal beliefs rather than fact.Astralcat wrote: Anything in the psychic, metaphysical, spiritual or 'occult' realms is eminently provable as fact within its own terms by those experienced to any degree of operating within them. "Within its own terms"? Seriously... this is almost exactly what Christians say about Jesus. "He must exist, because I have experienced him. I can prove he exists, because if you invite him into your life, you will experience him too". If you can't empirically prove something, it isn't a fact - it's a belief. Astralcat wrote: Glastonbury is a chakra in this respect, as it opens and helps develop individual spiritual energetic progression for those who want to work with its existing extremey powerful energy force. I disagree. Having lived here for the best part of 20 years, my experience of Glastonbury has been quite the opposite. I've lost count of the number of druids, priestesses and pilgrims of various spiritual persuasions who spout similar stuff about the place, and turn out to be thieves, bullies and violent misogynists (I'm not suggesting that this applies to you). You obviously met the wrong people. There are bullshitters and no good types in every field of human existence. They're easily spotted in this particular context and easily ignored and avoided. After 20 years, I think I can safely say that I've met a fairy representative cross-section of the Glastonbury spiritual community, and I have yet to see the faintest bit of evidence that Glastonbury offers "spiritual energetic progression" in a different way to any other place. You are of course free to believe differently, but that will remain a belief rather than a fact. How on earth would you see your 'evidence' if you're not personally engaged with and working with the thing you seek evidence of ? That is why these type of discussions end up being utterly pointless and just go around in circles. It's not about just meeting people, and as I have already said, discernment is very important when you do.
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woosh 35 posts |
Jul 31, 2013, 15:26
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'myth' comes from the word origin of 'mother' , nothing to do with a fiction. myths always stem from, or are at least based on well founded truths at source.
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Mustard 1043 posts |
Jul 31, 2013, 15:27
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woosh wrote: 'myth' comes from the word origin of 'mother' , nothing to do with a fiction. myths always stem from, or are at least based on well founded truths at source. Utter rubbish. There are myths surrounding Glastonbury that demonstrably originate in fictions spread by the church in the middle ages.
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Mustard 1043 posts |
Jul 31, 2013, 15:29
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Astralcat wrote: How on earth would you see your 'evidence' if you're not personally engaged with and working with the thing you seek evidence of ? That is why these type of discussions end up being utterly pointless and just go around in circles. It's not about just meeting people, and as I have already said, discernment is very important when you do. I have most certainly been engaged in the past. However, you don't need to be "engaged" to determine that Glastonbury doesn't represent anything above your average level of spiritual development. Or are you saying that only the initiated can judge the initiated? Sounding a bit like religious zeal again.... ;)
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Astralcat 742 posts |
Jul 31, 2013, 15:31
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Mustard wrote: Astralcat wrote: Subjective personal experience is fact. No it isn't. If I hallucinate a purple elephant, it doesn't mean that there's a purple elephant standing in front of me. You that that is not what I mean. Anyway, my final contribution to this discussion is just to say that there have been many people far greater than you or me throughout the ages that have experienced metaphysical realities as fact. Paranormal ? Not really, no. I would say utterly normal/natural but they are not compatible in with the limited scope of a purely materialistic world view and so therefore these discussions will always be rather pointless.
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Mustard 1043 posts |
Jul 31, 2013, 15:34
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Astralcat wrote: Mustard wrote: Astralcat wrote: Subjective personal experience is fact. No it isn't. If I hallucinate a purple elephant, it doesn't mean that there's a purple elephant standing in front of me. You that that is not what I mean. Anyway, my final contribution to this discussion is just to say that there have been many people far greater than you or me throughout the ages that have experienced metaphysical realities as fact. Paranormal ? Not really, no. I would say utterly normal/natural but they are not compatible in with the limited scope of a purely materialistic world view and so therefore these discussions will always be rather pointless. No they haven't. They have had subjective personal experiences. Facts can be proven. By definition, anything else isn't a fact. Because you can say one thing, and someone else can say the opposite, and without proof all you have is two different opinions. Simple. You are welcome to your opinion, but to claim it as fact is hubristic. I have many strongly-held beliefs, but I don't parade them as facts.
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