|
The Modern Antiquarian Forum » Uffington White Horse » uffington horse and the sun |
Log In to post a reply
|
|
|
|
| Topic View: Flat | Threaded | |
thesweetcheat 6214 posts |
Aug 18, 2017, 22:06
|
||
|
Evergreen Dazed wrote: thesweetcheat wrote: tiompan wrote: They were of the horse and the sunset from the observing position was not to the right . But even from there, if the sun is behind the viewer as ED suggests, the horse is still running generally towards it No it isn't! I have absolutely no idea how you are you arriving at that conclusion. It is very obviously not running generally towards it under those circumstances. The horse is coming closer to the viewer along the crest, it's not running away from the viewer NE. The line of the hillside that the horse is following heads away to the right of the photo then curves around the top of the manger. Once past the viewer it will be running WSW along the crest behind the viewer. And that's the direction where the sun is, behind the viewer.
|
|||
tiompan 5758 posts |
Aug 18, 2017, 22:13
|
||
|
thesweetcheat wrote: [quote="tiompan"] But even from there, if the sun is behind the viewer as ED suggests, the horse is still running generally towards it, not away from it, as the horse is clearly angled so that the head is nearer to the viewer than the tale is. The horse is going to run past the viewer as it heads along the side of the hill, it's not running away from them. But you know that isn't true , because you know what direction the horse is headed in ,if it were moving . That is the bottom line it is not heading towards any sunset no matter what the author imagined . There are countless points where the entire horse is in view and with the observer facing it the sunset will not be to their right . It's just a case of trawling through pics to find examples .The point 51.578610 ,-1.575137 would be a good example there must be pics from that point . But what does it matter, that when observing a monument the sunset would be to your right or left or straight on or behind you ? Do you really believe that is salient ? What would it imply etc ?
|
|||
|
thesweetcheat 6214 posts |
Aug 18, 2017, 22:30
|
||
|
tiompan wrote: But you know that isn't true , because you know what direction the horse is headed in ,if it were moving . I've given my view - it's running along the crest of the hill, not over it. A hill that lies generally SW in front of the horse, and from a distance (like the train line) the in-and-out of the manger is effectively flattened out to present a broad NE/SW canvas for it to run across. tiompan wrote: There are countless points where the entire horse is in view and with the observer facing it the sunset will not be to their right . It's just a case of trawling through pics to find examples .The point 51.578610 ,-1.575137 would be a good example there must be pics from that point . For anyone looking SE or south (the best angles to see the horse from), the sunset will always be on their right. Sure, if you stand on the hillside above the horse and look down on it, the sun will be on your left. But that's not a good angle to see the horse from at all and I don't believe its artist intended it to be viewed from there. tiompan wrote: But what does it matter, that when observing a monument the sunset would be to your right or left or straight on or behind you ? Do you really believe that is salient ? What would it imply etc ? But we're not talking about "a" monument, or monuments generally, where that would clearly be ridiculous. We're talking about a specific monument in the form of a galloping horse, on the side of a hill that lies broadly NE/SW, with its head on the right when viewed from the angle that best makes sense of it as a horse (i.e from the north or northwest) and from where the sunset is on the viewer's right as they look towards the horse.
|
|||
|
tiompan 5758 posts |
Aug 18, 2017, 23:33
|
||
|
Your view ignores something that you know to be true i.e. the horse is not galloping to the west . The best angle to see the horse is from above . How does that fit into good views with the sun set to the right ? That doesn't mean that there are not plenty of good views of the entire feature to be seen from other points ,including points to the west of the manger where the sunset will not be to the right i.e. it would be behind you . This refutes "And for anyone viewing the horse from a position where its horsiness can actually be seen, the sunset will be to their right. " You didn't explain why having the sunset in a particular direction is salient , but do seem keen to show that it is somehow important despite accepting " that there's nothing whatever to prove a link between the horse and the sun "
|
|||
|
Evergreen Dazed 1881 posts |
Edited Aug 18, 2017, 23:54
Aug 18, 2017, 23:34
|
||
|
thesweetcheat wrote: Evergreen Dazed wrote: thesweetcheat wrote: tiompan wrote: They were of the horse and the sunset from the observing position was not to the right . But even from there, if the sun is behind the viewer as ED suggests, the horse is still running generally towards it No it isn't! I have absolutely no idea how you are you arriving at that conclusion. It is very obviously not running generally towards it under those circumstances. The horse is coming closer to the viewer along the crest, it's not running away from the viewer NE. The line of the hillside that the horse is following heads away to the right of the photo then curves around the top of the manger. Once past the viewer it will be running WSW along the crest behind the viewer. And that's the direction where the sun is, behind the viewer. I think we're going to have to agree to disagree. It wouldn't even be running NE if it was turned upside down, because it is not on a NE/SW line, as has been pointed out many times now. From what I can gather, you are saying that if the horse stopped being on a broadly N/S line and was put on a NE/SW line, then it could be argued that it would be galloping toward the sunset. That would make some sense. But the reality is that it isn't 'pointing' SW, it's pointing almost S, where, as George has said, the sun does not rise or set. Never mind the curve of the hill or possible paths it might take, thats meaningless, the thing is not 'galloping' toward sunset!
|
|||
|
thesweetcheat 6214 posts |
Aug 19, 2017, 05:17
|
||
|
tiompan wrote: You didn't explain why having the sunset in a particular direction is salient , but do seem keen to show that it is somehow important despite accepting " that there's nothing whatever to prove a link between the horse and the sun " I've never said it was important or salient. I've said throughout that none of this proves anything about the sun being relevant to the horse. I don't think it is in all likelihood. The point I've been trying to get across is that you and ED are dismissing the possibility because of the fixed static alignment of the horse and the fact it doesn't line up with sunset. Whereas I take the view that the horse is capable of being interpreted as facing the sunset or moving towards it when you view it as an artistic representation from the direction where it is best seen as a horse, heading along a hillside. Not all intentions have to be explained by rigid proof or angles of alignment, in my view sometimes appearance and perception are equally as important when looking at a monument.
|
|||
|
nigelswift 8112 posts |
Edited Aug 19, 2017, 08:17
Aug 19, 2017, 07:27
|
||
|
tiompan wrote: You have to click on a few pics toget the right horse http://www.secretearth.com/attractions/2014-white-horse-hill-walk That image taught me something. It's ever so clear that the horse precisely follows the edge of the scarp so its prancing is due to that, not artistic intention.
|
|||
|
tiompan 5758 posts |
Edited Aug 19, 2017, 08:33
Aug 19, 2017, 08:31
|
||
|
My points were in response to the author .He is the one who introduced the suggestion that the horse was facing West .The only way to show that was in error is to point out how it wasn't and that meant using the same type of terminology . If you look over the posts I'm pretty sure you used more compass direction terminology than I did . Similarly you suggested that the sunset was on the right when looking at the horse ,to refute that I had to use your use of handedness . Ultimately the horse is not facing the sunset , any sunset ,you can also see the entire horse without the sunset being on your right ,that understanding was achieved by using as many perceptions as necessary to show that others who were also using their perceptions and relying on the appearance got it wrong .
|
|||
|
tiompan 5758 posts |
Aug 19, 2017, 08:47
|
||
|
nigelswift wrote: tiompan wrote: You have to click on a few pics toget the right horse http://www.secretearth.com/attractions/2014-white-horse-hill-walk That image taught me something. It's ever so clear that the horse precisely follows the edge of the scarp so its prancing is due to that, not artistic intention. There is so much to that could be said and discovered about the monument ,sadly the sun horse theory and everything here has added nothing . The refutations have just left us where we started . Fwiw , and only my worthless subjective view based on appearances from the plans , pics and GE (I'm discounting personal visits due to memory ) , the horse would not moving around the edge of the hill but continuing up what is left of the slope, prancing or galloping , it is unlikely to do such a sharp right turn when all the hard work has been done coming up the shoulder and the castle and barrow just straight ahead .
|
|||
|
Evergreen Dazed 1881 posts |
Aug 19, 2017, 09:33
|
||
|
I think the winter sun will be seen to set behind this new discovery at Uffington, if viewed from the hill. Should ruffle a few feathers. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z_B53IisHQc
|
| Pages: 11 – [ Previous | 1 … 4 5 6 7 8 9 | Next ] | Add a reply to this topic |
|
|
|
| The Modern Antiquarian Forum Index | |
