keith a
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Re: Cope vs. The Clash
Dec 14, 2009, 10:05
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Squid Tempest wrote: I thought it was a bit odd, to be honest. Didn't JC call the busking tour the Joe Strummer Memorial tour or some such?
And performed Rock The Casbah!
I have mixed feelings about The Clash. I don't like much of London Calling and find the greatest T&R band tag quite laughable.
And yet...they definitely had their moments. Great singles band for sure.
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mojojojo
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Re: Cope vs. The Clash
Dec 14, 2009, 11:09
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Never hads the slightest interest in The Clash. Got a right bollocking once from a Clash fan for saying that which put me off even more.
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The Sea Cat
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Edited Dec 14, 2009, 11:30
Re: Cope vs. The Clash
Dec 14, 2009, 11:29
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Lord Lucan wrote: Reading through Cope's review of the month I was really chuffed to read someone put into words what I've always felt about The Clash. I've never liked them, even though I've often felt on my own on this one. They've always struck me as humourless and overly earnest with a daft load of macho posturing and, at their worst, patronising. And anything that feels the need to declare itself as 'authentic' has always struck me as suspect. Protesting too much to be convincing. And the same goes for The Manic Street Preachers whose only difference is the willingness to use make-up. At last it's OK to say that The Clash say nothing to me about my life.
Yep. Me too. Utterly bovine adolescent posturing that morphed into a Walmart version of the Stones. As for the Manic Street Onanists.....
that'd ruin my teabreak.
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ToneStone
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Re: Cope vs. The Clash
Dec 14, 2009, 11:57
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Pompous fake pub rock crap masquerading as punk i would'nt gob on em if they were on fire. let's face it public schoolboys never made good punks ;)
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sanshee
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Edited Dec 14, 2009, 11:58
Re: Cope vs. The Clash
Dec 14, 2009, 11:58
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Utterly agree!
And when people say 'I learned all my politics from Strummer' I do worry for them. Well actually I don't. Serves 'em right;-)
I try to shrug The Clash off as being a bit 'naive', but they weren't exaclty 'youngsters' were they?
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IanB
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Edited Dec 14, 2009, 12:09
Re: Cope vs. The Clash
Dec 14, 2009, 12:05
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sanshee wrote: Utterly agree!
And when people say 'I learned all my politics from Strummer' I do worry for them. Well actually I don't. Serves 'em right;-)
I try to shrug The Clash off as being a bit 'naive', but they weren't exaclty 'youngsters' were they?
x
Hopefully The Clash (and TRB and bands like them) encouraged a few 15 year olds to think about politics and the wider world for the very first time. It's a bit like Prog fans learning to love Stravinsky or Lou Reed fans reading Dostoevsky and Delmore Schwartz. Aside from being drugging, boozing and shagging music rock n roll can open doors on to other worlds that your teachers and parents wont tell you about. Which is its great virtue, but the idea that you would still look at the world from that doorway as an adult is as frightening as the idea that anyone would base their adult political opinions on what a rock star says about the world.
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naughtynige
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Re: Cope vs. The Clash
Dec 14, 2009, 12:24
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Haven't we already done this topic to death?
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Toni Torino
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Re: Cope vs. The Clash
Dec 14, 2009, 12:29
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I think you have to decapitate it to truly kill it
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sanshee
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Re: Cope vs. The Clash
Dec 14, 2009, 12:33
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IanB wrote:
sanshee wrote:
Utterly agree!
And when people say 'I learned all my politics from Strummer' I do worry for them. Well actually I don't. Serves 'em right;-)
I try to shrug The Clash off as being a bit 'naive', but they weren't exaclty 'youngsters' were they?
x
Hopefully The Clash (and TRB and bands like them) encouraged a few 15 year olds to think about politics and the wider world for the very first time. It's a bit like Prog fans learning to love Stravinsky or Lou Reed fans reading Dostoevsky and Delmore Schwartz. Aside from being drugging, boozing and shagging music rock n roll can open doors on to other worlds that your teachers and parents wont tell you about. Which is its great virtue, but the idea that you would still look at the world from that doorway as an adult is as frightening as the idea that anyone would base their adult political opinions on what a rock star says about the world.
If The Clash did give any political inspiration, it can only be for the worst tbh.
For one, were they about 'socialism'?
Probably not, but they claim to be.
Strummer would bang on about 'squatting', when in reality socialism is more about 'paying rent' to help your fellow man, not concern yourself with yout own little expectations and demands of the world. He especially didn't have to 'squat'. He woz not skint.
Nowadays we see that kind of thing demean otherwise legitimate protest everwhere.. I think you know what I mean.
And Andy Kershaw up until he was able to maintained Strummer was some sort of 'prophet'. Doh!
As LL said, it's their 'patronising' tone that rankles most!
:-)
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IanB
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Edited Dec 14, 2009, 13:09
Re: Cope vs. The Clash
Dec 14, 2009, 12:45
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"As LL said, it's their 'patronising' tone that rankles most!"
Well yes. There is a long list of bands and songwriters in that category. Including most of the pantheon of critic's "greats" - Dylan, Neil Young and Lennon have all had their hectoring moments. Some never stopped.The current generation of stadium fillers are no different. Rock bands are only really any good at writing about their own self-obsession and their politics (sexual, socio-economic or ecological) spring entirely from a fairly narrow area of self-interest. Life as one long free ride with all the power and none of the responsibility. Adolescence extended indefinitely with, to misquote Alan Bennett, "the women following behind with a bucket".
Strummer was memorable for the odd stirring couplet, a couple of good haircuts and some original dental work. He was also part of a band who had a string of great little agit pop singles over about eighteen months. That's it. Beyond that all the "lets own the record company, lets own the radio station, lets treat the fans right" rhetoric was just that. Forfeiting royalties to keep Sandinista at under £6 was a huge act of hubris. The kindest thing they could have done for their audience would have been to edit it down to 45 mintutes and sold it for £3! They couldn't even get the Socialism bit right in their own back yard let alone in the wider world. Even a Fan Boy like Lester Bangs could see that yet there they all are, untouchables in the Rock Crit Hall Of Fame.
What do we really expect from an Art Form where the bar was always set low at entry level and gets lower every passing year?
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