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gogmagog 176 posts |
Edited Nov 28, 2008, 00:03
Nov 27, 2008, 22:37
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self righteous? your the one who wants to say everything i say is bollocks (tho not give any intelligent response back as to why, I'm still waiting for your pro-Adornian Treatise, by the way) - say, my opinion is naff (and oh so lesser than yours eh?), squeal ner ner ner ner ner ner - then start ranting and gettin increasingly irascible - and what generalisations by the way? I think ive been pretty specific as to what I (and others, btw) think of you. i tried being jokey right at the beginning to which you repsonded with more of your sarcastic bile - so like I said if its the only thing you understand then its what your gonna get back. My original comment on yes/Cow was said in that throwaway manner anyway! and then when brought to task on any of it - say oh it "was only a joke" - and your obviously so keen on having the last word - so i'm not gonna respond to anything else you say cos frankly I have better things to do - and like I said about ten posts ago nothing can or should be done about our difference of opinion re the two bands we like - so I said what your now saying half an hour ago other people who write on this site have already remarked to me that your not worth the effort.
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Stevo 6664 posts |
Nov 27, 2008, 22:46
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That was the first usage of the name Jefferson Starship. It was a solo project recorded during the existence of the Airplane, though I think the main bands drummers had just changed. I think the good stuff by JA is pretty much all with Spencer Dryden who is one drummer I think generally stands out anyway. There were a couple of years where JA were still going and had their custom label Grunt running. There are several other related projects on there that are similar, possibly better. This mainly because they're more song based. If you like Blows you should check out Baron Von Tollbooth & The Chrome Nun which is pretty similar & has a lot of the same side players. Main people being Paul Kantner & Grace slick for whom nicknames provided by David Crosby provide the title, there's also David Freiberg ex QMS in a central role plus Jerry Garcia etc adding guitars on several tracks. David Crosby's If I Could Only Remember My Name is somewhat similar though since Crosby's in central role also somewhat different. I think it's been discussed elsewhere in the thread and there's a review in the review section here(though I think it thought the lp was mainly acoustic when it's mainly electric as far as I can hear). There's a great Crosby/various Dead members bootleg from December 70 that has several of the same tracks played live plus a delicious version of Graham Nash's song The Wall. that boot goes by various names, I think the most popular is David & the Dorks. A lot of this music will be covered by articles talking about P.E.R.R.O as has been URLed elsewhere. There are several bootlegs of various recording sessions related to the overall project. i have several of them if you want. I owe you for that MX-80 Sound disc, don't I? stevo Np Henry Cow Freedom Rome In The Belly Of The Beast (got this on SonicStage so it's wound up being played a couple of times today. Looking forward to the Reccommended label box sets for more of this stuff in pristine sound plus the dvd which I've been hoping for for years)
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Popel Vooje 5373 posts |
Edited Nov 27, 2008, 23:40
Nov 27, 2008, 23:22
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I'll admit that prog isn't really my area, and that I'm no expert even on the better-known European stuff, let alone its American equivalent, but ioff the top of my head... Apart from the obvious (and already discussed) Zappa, and Todd Rundgren's Utopia (on whom Yes were an obvious and acknowledged influence, and whom I personally can't stomach for much the same reasons I can't stomach Yes) the only possible example I can think of is the Hampton Grease Band. They ceratainly had the virtuosity, the penchant for lengthy instrumental wig-outs and the ability to switch abruptly between time signatures. Nonetheless, they also had an abrasively raw, live-in-the-studio sound and an atonal proto-punk vocalist (Bruce Hampton's voice, oddly, is a dead ringer for that of Pere Ubu's David Thomas) that probably made them an anathema to many of the dope-smoking longhairs of the day who just wanted a quasi-intellectual chillout soundtrack to stroke their goatees to. Presumably this is why Columbia Records found their sole album "Music to Eat" so impossible to market that they promoted as a comedy record! (Many thanks both to Dog 3000 for turning me onto, and to Lawrence for copying me that marvellous commercial aberration, incidentally).
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Stevo 6664 posts |
Nov 27, 2008, 23:42
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The main guitarist went onto some respect in later prog oriented circles didn't he? Glenn Phillips I think his name is. & Colonel Bruce Hampton's getting recognition on the jam band circuit. According to reviews I read at the time the press release for the cd reissue made several totally over the top claims for the importance of the record in terms of influence on the US punk scene. In terms of it being the single root cause/trigger or something similar. I heard it was about the lowest selling record on the label ever for several years. It is really good in places though. The guitars definitely.
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Popel Vooje 5373 posts |
Nov 27, 2008, 23:44
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Dog 3000 wrote: How d'ya suppose Dylan & The Band fit in to all this? Couldn't folkie-goes-electric be seen as the prog of '65? (And those cats from The Band play their instruments as well as anybody ever has . . . especially Garth Hudson. Epic organ solo anyone?) Not sure how much the "space" stuff is important . . . Nah, I don't see them as being prog in the slightest, any more than the Clarence White-era Byrds were. Both bands may have been made up of virtuoso musicians, but their stuff is very concise and song-based, with very little in the way of instrumental fat (except for that live version of "Eight Miles High", admittedly).
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Lawrence 9547 posts |
Nov 28, 2008, 03:34
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Stevo wrote: That was the first usage of the name Jefferson Starship. It was a solo project recorded during the existence of the Airplane, though I think the main bands drummers had just changed. I think the good stuff by JA is pretty much all with Spencer Dryden who is one drummer I think generally stands out anyway. There were a couple of years where JA were still going and had their custom label Grunt running. There are several other related projects on there that are similar, possibly better. This mainly because they're more song based. If you like Blows you should check out Baron Von Tollbooth & The Chrome Nun which is pretty similar & has a lot of the same side players. Main people being Paul Kantner & Grace slick for whom nicknames provided by David Crosby provide the title, there's also David Freiberg ex QMS in a central role plus Jerry Garcia etc adding guitars on several tracks. David Crosby's If I Could Only Remember My Name is somewhat similar though since Crosby's in central role also somewhat different. I think it's been discussed elsewhere in the thread and there's a review in the review section here(though I think it thought the lp was mainly acoustic when it's mainly electric as far as I can hear). There's a great Crosby/various Dead members bootleg from December 70 that has several of the same tracks played live plus a delicious version of Graham Nash's song The Wall. that boot goes by various names, I think the most popular is David & the Dorks. A lot of this music will be covered by articles talking about P.E.R.R.O as has been URLed elsewhere. There are several bootlegs of various recording sessions related to the overall project. i have several of them if you want. I owe you for that MX-80 Sound disc, don't I? stevo Np Henry Cow Freedom Rome In The Belly Of The Beast (got this on SonicStage so it's wound up being played a couple of times today. Looking forward to the Reccommended label box sets for more of this stuff in pristine sound plus the dvd which I've been hoping for for years) I wouldn't mind having one of those boots. You still have my e-mail address?
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Lawrence 9547 posts |
Nov 28, 2008, 03:36
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Popel Vooje wrote: I'll admit that prog isn't really my area, and that I'm no expert even on the better-known European stuff, let alone its American equivalent, but ioff the top of my head... Apart from the obvious (and already discussed) Zappa, and Todd Rundgren's Utopia (on whom Yes were an obvious and acknowledged influence, and whom I personally can't stomach for much the same reasons I can't stomach Yes) the only possible example I can think of is the Hampton Grease Band. They ceratainly had the virtuosity, the penchant for lengthy instrumental wig-outs and the ability to switch abruptly between time signatures. Nonetheless, they also had an abrasively raw, live-in-the-studio sound and an atonal proto-punk vocalist (Bruce Hampton's voice, oddly, is a dead ringer for that of Pere Ubu's David Thomas) that probably made them an anathema to many of the dope-smoking longhairs of the day who just wanted a quasi-intellectual chillout soundtrack to stroke their goatees to. Presumably this is why Columbia Records found their sole album "Music to Eat" so impossible to market that they promoted as a comedy record! (Many thanks both to Dog 3000 for turning me onto, and to Lawrence for copying me that marvellous commercial aberration, incidentally). Yr very welcome PV. :)
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IanB 6761 posts |
Edited Nov 28, 2008, 08:04
Nov 28, 2008, 08:04
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gogmagog wrote: be sure to check out the RAM and HARMONIUM LPs Ian, if you haven't already - coupla proper gems. regards, gogmagog The Harmonium from Quebec? Yes I have two records and they really are quite good. Not quite up there with Le Orme and Banco but still worthwhile and musically representative of the romantic ideal in Prog. At least musically. I don't speak French so they could be singing about shoes for all I know. Have you ever heard Max Webster (from Sarnia, Ontario)? Kind of Glam Prog Lite. Not terrible. A cross between Tull, Cheap Trick and Queen.
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IanB 6761 posts |
Edited Nov 28, 2008, 11:13
Nov 28, 2008, 08:09
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Dog 3000 wrote: How d'ya suppose Dylan & The Band fit in to all this? Couldn't folkie-goes-electric be seen as the prog of '65? (And those cats from The Band play their instruments as well as anybody ever has . . . especially Garth Hudson. Epic organ solo anyone?) Not sure how much the "space" stuff is important . . . I think of The Band are the North American Fairports. They were backwards looking (in a good way) not sure there was anything utopian about them as their view of American history is not idealised. Romantic perhaps. I would have loved to have heard Yes with Levon Helm instead of Bruford and VdGG with Hudson instead of Banton.
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gogmagog 176 posts |
Edited Nov 28, 2008, 09:09
Nov 28, 2008, 09:06
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Yes, I've often seen Max Webster Lp's knocking about. Always been told they were kind of a more commercial Rush-type thing. Worth a punt if seen cheap are they, Ian? yes, it is that harmonium. It seems the pastoral Genesis thing was big news in Canada. Course, there was the famous Genesis Black Tour show in Montreal in 1974. regards, Gogmagog PS: Can't reccomend the RAm Lp enough, specially for A Magma-fiend and bass-player like yerself (and myself) - the solo is outrageous!
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