necropolist
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Re: Too much packaging
Oct 16, 2003, 09:52
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>Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.
aagghhh! NO. Wrong, wrong, wrong! Right, I'll just do me breathing exercises, especially as I've just been arguing with a copper about the release of Winston Silcott, and, funnilly enough his opinion on that ones wound me up a tad, so I'll try not to take it out on you....
but that argument just really pisses me off too. For a start it is plain wrong - it IS the manufatureres who create all the excess packaging in the first place. Do you think there were hoards of people writing to heinz or whoever demanding an extra layer of plastic sheeting? Of course not, the maufacturers knew they could do it and it would probably lead to increased sales because it makes the goods seem more attractive, maybe even healthier (the way the goods are presented on the labelling etc), even in some cases (I'm thinking tetrapaks here) more environmentally friendly.
Do you want to tax people for being conned, rather than the con artists themselves?
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necropolist
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Re: Irish bintifada
Oct 16, 2003, 10:02
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Appreciate the legal nicety of how collection is 'free' - but that's actually bollocks isn't it. Nothings bloody free, so it is a double tax.
Also, there's no national insurance in Ireland is there? Which means your taxes are lower than the UK's - already some of the lowest in Europe. Even if I'm wrong about that, then your taxes are roughly the same as the UK, tho the cost of the NHS would add about 3% to total tax bills, iirr, to be roughly the same as the UK's (hope that makes sense). Also, corporate traxation is probably key - and there Irish tax levels are outrageously low.
as to the recycling plant, i read (since the other post) that it had actually been closed down last year, rather than was threatened with closure, and that it was the only such facility in the country.
if the campaign is defeated, the picture will get much worse as well. it is all about the run up tp privatisation, and getting more rubbish for bloody incinerators - and you couldn't get much more anti-green than them!
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Nat
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Re: Too much packaging
Oct 16, 2003, 10:09
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At the end of the day thou, it's down to individuals choice... the manufacturer may do all this fancy packaging, but you aren't forced to buy it! You don't have to buy it.. if you don't buy it the manufacturer 'could' be forced to not stock it anymore (if you see what I mean).. as I said above it's about the individual, ignorance and an easy life attitude.
Don't buy the fancy packaging! Then it won't be wasted...
Now what am I going to do with my excess of plastic flower pots?!! :o)
Nat xxx
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necropolist
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Re: Too much packaging
Oct 16, 2003, 10:51
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& if your kids only like brand x and refuse to eat anything else? or if you just happen to like said brand, just not their packaging? or if you've been conned into buying it because they've made you think this kind of packaging is more eco-friendly, or the product is healthier?
they made it. even if a few eco-conscious people stopped buying it, they'd still keep making it. unless they are MADE to pay for it, lets face reality, it won't happen.
to do otherwise is just to shift the blame, to leave the bulk of the population paying for the shit created by the tiny minority.
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Nat
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Re: Too much packaging
Oct 16, 2003, 10:52
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Lol You are funny.... :op
Sigh..... tee hee
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FourWinds
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Re: Irish bintifada
Oct 16, 2003, 16:19
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"... when it should be the repsonsibility of those who CREATE the waste in the first place."
It IS their responsibility! Under EU Law the manufacturers are obliged to take packaging back and dispose of it. You can leave your packaging at the supermarket.
Soon, car manufacturers will be resposible for the disposal of cars taken off the road.
As for spare time. Well, folks would have more if they wanted less wouldn't they. Ooh .. that sounded bad. It wasn't supposed to sound that bad. What I mean is that so many people are slaves to their credit cards etc. I know there are people who can't afford the necessaries, let alone the luxories, but there's also folks who can't afford them that try to.
***********
My whole take on this is that the following should be FREE:
Bread, drinking water, milk, public transport, tampons, basic clothing (because we are forced to dress) and waste disposal.
All this could be done through taxes, but it would obviously have to be on a world wide basis. It ain't never going to happen is it!?
I just think that, at the moment, a bin tax is a good kick up the arse for the rubbish creators/prolongers to sort out their acts.
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FourWinds
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Re: Irish bintifada
Oct 16, 2003, 16:29
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" Which means your taxes are lower than the UK's"
That is completely wrong. I moved here for a higher paid job and was worse off. I had to ask for a significant pay rise within months of being here.
The cost of living in Dublin is the highest in Europe.
VAT is higher than in the UK.
On top of the high income tax we have PRSI, which is the same sort of thing as NI. On top of that we have VHI, which is a semi-private medical scheme to pay for health care.
We pay for every trip to the doctors or dentist.
What people forget is that Ireland is a big place with hardly any people in it. There are more people in the Birmingham conurbation than live in Ireland! It all has to be payed for somehow. If you want an infrastructure then it needs to be paid for and when an economy is booming like Dublin's is it's better to get it through taxes rather than state borrowing.
Company taxation. Yes, it's scandalously low ... 10% !!!!! but without that Ireland would still be a third world country (some of it still is).
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FourWinds
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Re: Irish bintifada
Oct 16, 2003, 16:30
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And I'm one of those folks still paying off stupid debts years down the line :-(
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FourWinds
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Re: Too much packaging
Oct 16, 2003, 16:40
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Anyway, I don't know why you're so hooked on this one. Try something closer to home, like my now retired parents council tax being put up to more than a months pension!
Nearly 1/10 of their income goes on bloody council tax!
Just because they stupidly have a few quid put by to pay for their funerals! Fecking disgrace.
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FourWinds
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A compromise
Oct 16, 2003, 16:46
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I think this would work and who could argue with it if it was done correctly.
A 'bag-limit' be established for a family (dependant upon size obviously). This would be collected for free, but anything over that you pay for. This is the same as the German system with the special bags that cost a fortune.
In Irelnad, we have free collection of paper and cans already, which a lot of people take advantage of. This scheme just needs expanding to cover other watse catagories.
I'll be writing to a couple of recycling companies to find out about the bottle/galss situation.
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