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The Modern Antiquarian Forum » Orkney » Britain's Ancient Capital: Secrets Of Orkney |
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Dog in fog 317 posts |
Edited Jan 05, 2017, 22:36
Jan 05, 2017, 22:35
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After that first day of good weather, we decided to go back to the Ring of Brodgar at night. We took three other lone travellers with us who were staying at the same hostel, and went around 11pm. Too fantastic to describe, but it felt like you could touch the milky way. I wandered off alone around the ring - eyes as big as saucers in the dark - and said hello to a few of the stones. Priceless.
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Markoid 1621 posts |
Jan 05, 2017, 22:57
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There is absolutely no question that I'm gonna have a look at Orkney and Lewis. It's quite odd that most Scottish people don't even think about going to the islands. West or North. They are quite stunning places. I guess most people in the cities are just getting on with life!
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tjj 3606 posts |
Edited Jan 05, 2017, 23:13
Jan 05, 2017, 23:11
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Dog in fog wrote: After that first day of good weather, we decided to go back to the Ring of Brodgar at night. We took three other lone travellers with us who were staying at the same hostel, and went around 11pm. Too fantastic to describe, but it felt like you could touch the milky way. I wandered off alone around the ring - eyes as big as saucers in the dark - and said hello to a few of the stones. Priceless. I think you've probably touched on something that links stone circles - I wasn't lucky enough to be at the Ring of Brodgar at night but got high on the blueness of the sky on the day I visited. A long way south out by Silbury Hill one frosty night a few years back I climbed out of friend's car and had what I can only describe as a transcendental experience when I looked up at the night sky. I had never seen so many stars or felt I could reach up and touch them before. I've seen starry nights at Avebury since, when the Milky Way was clearly visible but have never had quite that intense experience again. Maybe the key to what links stone circles is in the stars.
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Dog in fog 317 posts |
Edited Jan 06, 2017, 09:42
Jan 06, 2017, 09:37
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Hi tjj, I really have no knowledge about the positioning of sites being linked to astronomical phenomena. All I know is, it was ruddy fantastic! The sense of history and mystery was palpable, enhanced a thousandfold by the skies and surroundings.
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moss 2897 posts |
Jan 06, 2017, 10:15
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Think the less we know, the more we appreciate the mystery of the stones and of nature. The question is of course, does it come from ourselves the feeling of sheer joy in the world or is it something that is emanating from the world around us, a slow pulse of life.....
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tiompan 5758 posts |
Jan 06, 2017, 11:44
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Totally disagree Moss .Greater understanding is more likely to lead to greater appreciation .What was previously considered mundane or dismissed , from members of our own species to all other species , from large monuments to the piece of bone in a cist ,to the dirt around the cist , all now more generally given a respect unthinkable even a few decades ago . The source of our aesthetic appreciation/joy of phenomena , e.g. stars or ancient monuments or collectively is due to their presence but the quality of the experience is due to our filtering of the experience . Others may be offended by the monument , seeing it as an example of pagan beliefs or an obstacle to provision of much needed food or homes . Our contemporary understanding (huge distances , possible other inhabited worlds , not believing they influence our lives etc ) of the stars would underpin a different experience from someone who would have perceived them as having an impact on their lives . Seeing a comet over Stonehenge would not be a delight if you thought it would bring bad luck .
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Markoid 1621 posts |
Edited Jan 06, 2017, 14:08
Jan 06, 2017, 13:48
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There is a reason why stones exist. There's actually is a reason for them, not just speculating. Mystery is for mystery. Facts are a different matter. which is why we should find out why they existed in the first place. I think ceremonial - like churches. Take yourself back to 5000 years ago. What would you do? No historian has the answer. Just exist I guess, which is what we are doing right now! I'm looking for questions, not for answers. Like, why? And does it really matter? Religion is for the dumb. Community?
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moss 2897 posts |
Edited Jan 06, 2017, 15:07
Jan 06, 2017, 15:02
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[quote="tiompan"]Totally disagree Moss .Greater understanding is more likely to lead to greater appreciation .What was previously considered mundane or dismissed , from members of our own species to all other species , from large monuments to the piece of bone in a cist ,to the dirt around the cist , all now more generally given a respect unthinkable even a few decades ago ." Well I knew we would disagree, and no I am not standing in the way of education though it has a lot to answer for...... the truth of the matter is that we only take a little of the picture from the archaeological ground, the essential life and spirit is dead, and we fill in the corners with speculation. Subjectively I would be delighted to see a comet, and how many people through the ages will also have taken pure delight and awe in the stars and comets. I truthfully don't see any other person as different from myself. Anyway my favourite poem on Stonehenge which to me sums up the mess we seem to find ourselves in when we come to interpretation of these enigmatic stones Stonehenge which actually has the 'wow' factor though severely disrupted by all those 'educated' people ;) A Game of Henge - Stonehenge Phillip Gross A game of Henge, my masters? The pieces are set. We lost the box with instructions years ago. Do you see Hangman? Or Clock Patience? Building bricks the gods grew out of? Dominoes? It's your move. You're in the ring of the hills, of the stones, of the walls of your skull. You want to go? You want out? Good - that's the game. Whichever way you turn are doors. Choose. Step through, so... And whichever world you stumble into will be different from all the others, only what they might have been, you'll never know.
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tjj 3606 posts |
Edited Jan 06, 2017, 20:15
Jan 06, 2017, 15:09
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I agree with your well argued rationale Tiompan but on the other hand do get what Moss was saying. Last night an old friend (now on FB) posted an unspectacular shot of the moon with Venus also just visible in the shot. He accompanied his photo with some complicated astronomical calculations ... I also had been looking at the moon (and Venus) earlier in the evening and greatly appreciated what I saw without possessing the in-depth astronomical knowledge my friend has. Edited:(was waffling)
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Dog in fog 317 posts |
Jan 06, 2017, 15:51
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Just tagging onto the general discussion. I'm aware it may seem as though I rejoice in being willfully ignorant. It's not that at all: I just cannot think scientifically. Nor am I a pagan; nor do I follow any religions. I experience life as a preposterous very long play. The more exceptional scenes featuring eg stone circles foster a massive increase of 'in the moment' attention and wonder. I appreciate that others may enjoy performing ceremonies or conducting scientific research respectively. In the artist's mausoleum I found myself in on Christmas Day in Oslo, of course I marvelled that a person or people with knowledge of physics and acoustics had built a place with a 10 second reverb effect! But talk of sound waves and concrete's properties and equations would not reach my excitement button in my mind, so I sang and scribbled a few lines of no-doubt rubbish poetry. That does not lessen my general appreciation that someone else was excited enough to pursue and create that space. Let alone, every inch of wall and ceiling is covered with the artist's art! Similarly, the same scientists may be completely incapable of playing an instrument - due to being tone deaf or not excited enough to practise for hours - but would love going to concerts and enjoying the fruits of a musician's passion and talents. It's a good job we're all different! ;-)
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