nigelswift
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Re: Trump. Vaguely cheering news.
Jul 18, 2018, 09:47
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Well obviously the fact people are saying the problem is other than guns IS the problem so I don't know how you wish me to expand on that.
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Captain Starlet
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Re: Trump. Vaguely cheering news.
Jul 18, 2018, 10:37
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Exactly, this is how it all began in Germany in the 1930's. Sadly people today are too willing to either ignore history or just pretend none of this is happening.
When a leader of a country as powerful as the US starts courting Nazis then that's the way the country is heading. He's the leader of that country and the person who directly steers the political and moral direction in which the country heads.
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goffik
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Re: Trump. Vaguely cheering news.
Jul 18, 2018, 13:36
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I can't believe this hasn't been mentioned here, yet - it's probably just too obvious. But I can't see how this is acceptable:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-44864739
No doubt the gullibles will continue to turn a blind eye to it. I'm dying to see what Putin's response will be, cos he seemed quite happy when Trump said the total opposite in his presence! :D
G x
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Locodogz
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Re: Trump. Vaguely cheering news.
Jul 18, 2018, 15:00
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Whilst loathe to put words into other people's mouths (apologies Nigel) I'm gonna try here.
So in every Sandy Hook, more recently Las Vegas, tragedy I suggest that the damage and fallout would have been markedly less in the absence of firearms?
So I'd suggest that - notwithstanding the 'issues' of the perpetrators concerned - their (seemingly easy) access to firearms is key in delivering the level of death and injuries that arise. You could go mad with a monkey wrench but the death toll would probably be lower?
As to a solution - well that's much much harder - I've sympathy for the view that the genie is out of the bottle in terms of the sheer number of guns in circulation in the US, although that doesn't necessarily mean that steps shouldn't be taken to start to try to curb this?
Best solution I heard was the comedian (real comedian) who suggested that you start to charge $1000 per bullet!?!
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Locodogz
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Re: Trump. Vaguely cheering news.
Jul 18, 2018, 15:05
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Obfuscate, deflect, yawn......
The comment was about Trump's support of American "nazis" not Obama's support for (ahem, alleged) Ukranian facists.
Do try to keep up
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nigelswift
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Re: Trump. Vaguely cheering news.
Jul 18, 2018, 16:54
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Locodogz wrote: So in every Sandy Hook, more recently Las Vegas, tragedy I suggest that the damage and fallout would have been markedly less in the absence of firearms?
I LOVE that. Are you British? You sound British. ;)
Locodogz wrote: "the genie is out of the bottle in terms of the sheer number of guns in circulation in the US".
True, but that doesn't stop the laws on carrying them, still less using them, being vastly more strict, like elsewhere. That would definitely help and the only reason it isn't happening is the opposition to it from shits in check shirts. Strangely, they're mostly called Butch.
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thesweetcheat
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Re: Trump. Vaguely cheering news.
Jul 18, 2018, 19:30
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Exactly. Countries that have strict rules on gun control have provably lower rates of gun-related deaths per capita.
The UK introduced stricter controls in the wake of Dunblane and - guess what? - no equivalent mass shooting has happened here in the subsequent 20-odd years. It's not rocket science.
The stuff about the untouchable 2nd Amendment is hooey too. The clue being that it's an "Amendment" i.e. introduced by a *change in the constitution*. And it was enacted when people had muskets, not high calibre rapid fire assault weopons.
And wasn't it the Trump regime that reduced the controls by making it okay for people with mental health issues to have free access to guns?
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thesweetcheat
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Re: Trump. Vaguely cheering news.
Jul 18, 2018, 19:32
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Only fair :)
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nigelswift
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Re: Trump. Vaguely cheering news.
Jul 18, 2018, 20:28
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thesweetcheat wrote:
The stuff about the untouchable 2nd Amendment is hooey too.
Indeed it is. Unless you're called Butch and have a check shirt and are wilfully blind. Circumstances alter cases, especially after 227 effing years. Same with the referendum after a lot less time than that.
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phallus dei
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Re: Trump. Vaguely cheering news.
Jul 19, 2018, 01:08
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Rhiannon wrote: Respectable governments of the UK and the US don't usually court the vote of extremists though. Trump's failure to condemn the people doing the saluting and the marching is accepting their support by omission, and it emboldens that sort of nazi saluting nutcase to think their head of state is on their side. They start thinking they're mainstream.
I already posted a link in this thread in reply to you earlier showing that Trump did specifically condemn the KKK presence at the Charlottesville rally; please modify your comments accordingly if you want the discussion to go forward. Otherwise, it is a waste of effort on both sides to simply state the same comments again & again.
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