anthonyqkiernan
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Re: Wind farms v Birds
Jan 28, 2004, 13:22
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Totally. Was just sharpening your arguement for you.
;-)
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Nat
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Re: Wind farms v Birds
Jan 28, 2004, 13:23
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Why Thank you.... :op
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morfe
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Re: Wind farms v Birds
Jan 28, 2004, 14:48
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http://www.geocities.com/nigbarnes/
Arguments against windpower.
It makes me sad to see a master of the wind slain by an inefficient eyesore. This doesn't mean I'm not cogent of the need for energy. Just saddened. The red kite was down to 5 pairs in Wales ( in Britain there was only 12 known birds!) in 1905. It's been a labour of love to return it to 'rare' status, triumphing through DDT, constant shootings, poison-baiting and myxomatosis.
"A large turbine in Gloucestershire saves less than the amount of carbon dioxide produced by just one articulated lorry. At Nympsfield in Gloucestershire a single 500kW gearless Enercon turbine was commissioned in Dec 1996. Its annual output is about .11 million kWh (Tilting At windmills BBC2, 2.2.99). Since the turbine generates not only during the day, when it might displace oil- or coal-fired generation, but also at night when mainly nuclear and gas generation are still operating, it us logical to assume that it displaces a mix of fuels, rather than only coal or oil. Department of Trade and Industry figures indicate that the 1995 generating fuel mix produced an average of 620g of carbon dioxide per unit of electricity generated. Thus we can calculate that the Nympsfield turbine saved about 688 tonnes each year, or 0.078 tonnes per hour. An articulated lorry travelling at 50mph along a motorway produces 0.08 tonnes of carbon dioxide per hour. Given the uncontrolled growth of road traffic, the erecting of turbines is a futile exercise. How many turbines would we have to build each year merely to keep pace with traffic growth?"
Waiting for the crash....
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neighbourofthedrude
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Re: Wind farms v Birds
Jan 28, 2004, 14:53
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I'm a bird and i think wind farms are cool !
8op
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Lord Lucan
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Wind farms v Birds?
Jan 28, 2004, 15:13
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It seems to me there doesn't have to be a choice between one or the other. If you scale down to domestic wind fans used by us humans to keep cool in summer, the way we make them safe for kiddies' and stoners' fingers is by having a grille on them to keep the fan blades away from soft fleshy bits. Why can't this strategy just be scaled up and done with wind farms too?
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FourWinds
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Re: Wind farms v Birds
Jan 28, 2004, 15:14
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People who think that wind power is just part of a solution to green issues are being grossly misled. And they are being misled by people who quote figures like the ones your source above uses.
The reason for building turbines is because pretty soon we won't have many other ways of producing the electricity we need. Even with shit loads of turbines we won't be able to do anyway.
The answer? We all go for nuclear power to reduce greenhouse emmissions from power plants and just wait for the lorry to become unviable due to lack of fuel resources ....
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FourWinds
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Re: Wind farms v Birds?
Jan 28, 2004, 15:16
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Turbines rely on having very little wind resistance in their main structure so that they turn with the wind just like a weather vane. A big grill thingy would probably, to use a technical term, "fuck this up" :-)
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FourWinds
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Not "very little wind resistance", but a "carefully designed wind resistance"
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mojojojo
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Re: Wind farms v Birds
Jan 28, 2004, 15:23
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I do see what you mean, of course, and I'm not trying to argue with anyone. It just saddens me that something that I felt positive about does this damage. Just what is the answer???!!! AAgghh!!
It's just frustrating is all :-)
x
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morfe
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birdcage
Jan 28, 2004, 15:24
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It sounds expensive and structurally nigh on impossible at that scale, plus it would be an even bigger eyesore. Those are my rushed thoughts, because m'lord it too was one of the first things I thought of!
Tidal/wave power and efficiently regenerating our waste seem to be the best options in the UK in the long term. But we humanoids are a species addicted to growth. We are culturally unsustainable. I think our eventual response to the power thang will be forced by resulting problems rather than ingenious planning. Until communities (villages/towns/hamlets/cities?) begin to generate their own electricity using self-contained sustainable/clean methods, we are pissing into the ocean of an ever growing demand for an ever-diminishing resource (fossil fuels)
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