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bladup 1986 posts |
Sep 14, 2012, 15:29
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nigelswift wrote: Apart from the features that can only be seen if you eat mushrooms (which I'll obviously have to nip up Malvern Hills this afternoon to kit myself out to see), could you please post links to images of rock art panels depicting the other twenty things you mention? I say only about half of the carvings are physically real places and the rest abstract images [ 50 50 physical world/ spirit world ], you may joke but go anywhere where there's rock art and mushrooms, brew up about 1000 and i'll tell you, you'll understand rock art in a fuller way after you've looked at the rocks, the hillforts on the rocks [ there's a few ] are mainly in northumberland and southern scotland [but lots of other places as well , the ringcairns and stone circles are shown on rocks on the hillside at ilkley [ and other places like it ] showing you what ritual places are up on the moor, i've also tripped and seen energy match the patterns at rowtor rocks as well, the rest is more for one of the many books i have in me that i keep for a rainy day, or for when i ever need to join the real/shitty world, believe me though i've been visiting them for over 13 years and have seen [ and have photo's ] of everything i listed [at various places], and just one more thing i've seen energy pattens on rocks without carvings, it was there but not as neat [ clear ], so maybe one thing the rock art does is make the energy flow neater and therefore it looks neater and better with the rock art because the carvings help contain the flow of energy [ if i say much more, i'll be losing my pension ], so maybe the ancients were learning to control energy that we in the so called scientific age don't even know is there [ or though everybody knows rocks do contain energy ], now look for that knowledge [of the flows of energy that naturally exist] on a bigger scale with there monuments, especially the stone circles, ring cairns, henges [the biggest energies often but not always follow faults], chambered cairns, cairns, barrows, and sometimes even their settlements and i think you can see evidence for it there as well.
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Rhiannon 5291 posts |
Sep 14, 2012, 15:39
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One thing though Bladup. How do you know how much of the images / symbols you saw when taking the mushrooms (or whatever plant) were due to your expectations? That is to say, did you and your friends see certain things because you'd already read about / discussed these energies or possible meanings of the carvings? I've read about people taking ayahuasca in south america and seeing the types of patterns reported by the local people. Without controlled experiment, how can we know how much is due to cultural expectation, how much is personal expectation, how much is down to the physiological effects of those particular chemicals in the brain? We don't have the same cultural or personal expectations as the neolithic people, surely?
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nigelswift 8112 posts |
Sep 14, 2012, 15:46
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i wasnt joking, I would genuinely like to see photos of the 20 things you say are depicted on panels that you dont need mushrooms for. Give us the pics, thats all, words are so much less illustrative. And no, Im not decrying 'shrooms as an aid to looking at rock art. Take this panel http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/tayside_and_central/8205035.stm Dunno if the discoverer bloke was high but its a fact that if you are you realise the panel is four dimensional.... The 4th dimension is TIME. And thats important. The marks could have been added progressively over several thousand years so looking them as a whole may be looking at them wrong, and saying they are a star map or a spring map or whatever could be a big mistake, albeit understandable at first sight.
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bladup 1986 posts |
Sep 14, 2012, 15:59
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Rhiannon wrote: One thing though Bladup. How do you know how much of the images / symbols you saw when taking the mushrooms (or whatever plant) were due to your expectations? That is to say, did you and your friends see certain things because you'd already read about / discussed these energies or possible meanings of the carvings? I've read about people taking ayahuasca in south america and seeing the types of patterns reported by the local people. Without controlled experiment, how can we know how much is due to cultural expectation, how much is personal expectation, how much is down to the physiological effects of those particular chemicals in the brain? We don't have the same cultural or personal expectations as the neolithic people, surely? No expectations at all because we didn't know the stone we were looking at had rock art until it happened, i was at ilkley to visit the stone circle and wasn't even interested in rock art back then [it's what made me interested], scientist's have done loads of tests in labs and people constantly reports seeing images that you see all the time at rock art sites, we do a similar thing but at the sites, and that's when it all makes sense, like i said to understand [ or disagree ] go to a site brew up or eat a 1000 liberty caps and sit and look at the rock [ one with abstract art, not one with a map of the region ], you'll then understand rock art in a way you didn't before, even if you can't get to a rock art stone you can try it on one without as you will still see the energy the stone holds very clearly anyway.
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Rhiannon 5291 posts |
Sep 14, 2012, 16:05
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frankly I think 100 would be more than ample, I can't imagine I'd ever find my way home again if I took 1000 :)
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tiompan 5758 posts |
Sep 14, 2012, 16:09
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nigelswift wrote: i wasnt joking, I would genuinely like to see photos of the 20 things you say are depicted on panels that you dont need mushrooms for. Give us the pics, thats all, words are so much less illustrative. And no, Im not decrying 'shrooms as an aid to looking at rock art. Take this panel http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/tayside_and_central/8205035.stm Dunno if the discoverer bloke was high but its a fact that if you are you realise the panel is four dimensional.... The 4th dimension is TIME. And thats important. The marks could have been added progressively over several thousand years so looking them as a whole may be looking at them wrong, and saying they are a star map or a spring map or whatever could be a big mistake, albeit understandable at first sight. The discover bloke was quite high , about 2000 ft OD .
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bladup 1986 posts |
Sep 14, 2012, 16:14
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nigelswift wrote: i wasnt joking, I would genuinely like to see photos of the 20 things you say are depicted on panels that you dont need mushrooms for. Give us the pics, thats all, words are so much less illustrative. And no, Im not decrying 'shrooms as an aid to looking at rock art. Take this panel http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/tayside_and_central/8205035.stm Dunno if the discoverer bloke was high but its a fact that if you are you realise the panel is four dimensional.... The 4th dimension is TIME. And thats important. The marks could have been added progressively over several thousand years so looking them as a whole may be looking at them wrong, and saying they are a star map or a spring map or whatever could be a big mistake, albeit understandable at first sight. Talk about looking at things with modern eyes, everything i listed WOULD have meant something real in their day to day lives, they would know where I'm coming from, they would have no understanding of a 4 th dimension of time or any dimension for that matter, physical world/ spirit world maybe and of cause things would be added over time as things change over time, the landscape started to change so much because of us as well, do you really think the ancients were quantum physicists? i do not!!! and i doubt "you know who" was high, because if he was he may understand that world a lot more, just because he can find them doesn't mean he understands them at all.
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tjj 3606 posts |
Sep 14, 2012, 16:15
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Rhiannon wrote: frankly I think 100 would be more than ample, I can't imagine I'd ever find my way home again if I took 1000 :) Ye gods, 100!! ... Please don't think I'm being a fuddyduddy - I've been following this discussion with great interest and am impressed at the patience of the answers given. My message to Bladup is clear your mind, do some meditating if helps but do stop taking hallucinogens - I believe they have a long term effect on your mental faculties (someone's got to say it).
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Sanctuary 4670 posts |
Sep 14, 2012, 16:15
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tiompan wrote: nigelswift wrote: i wasnt joking, I would genuinely like to see photos of the 20 things you say are depicted on panels that you dont need mushrooms for. Give us the pics, thats all, words are so much less illustrative. And no, Im not decrying 'shrooms as an aid to looking at rock art. Take this panel http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/tayside_and_central/8205035.stm Dunno if the discoverer bloke was high but its a fact that if you are you realise the panel is four dimensional.... The 4th dimension is TIME. And thats important. The marks could have been added progressively over several thousand years so looking them as a whole may be looking at them wrong, and saying they are a star map or a spring map or whatever could be a big mistake, albeit understandable at first sight. The discover bloke was quite high , about 2000 ft OD . Must be a star map then :-) I got a bollocking from a bloke on Bodmin moor when I was drawing back the grass layer off a stone. I said don't worry I'm doing it very carefully and not damaging any archaeology. Archaeology? he said, I'm thinking of the insect life beneath it!!
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Rhiannon 5291 posts |
Sep 14, 2012, 16:20
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I think you're being too hasty. I think the carvers would have (possibly) had a more close relationship with time than us because they'd have necessarily have had to be aware of cyclical changes with the seasons - it'd have affected where they could find their food and what food they could eat. And imagine how darkness would curtail your goings-about when you couldn't flick a light switch on. So if they were carving the symbols / shapes over an extended period of time, that might make a lot of sense, connecting one cycle to another. Maybe if you were nomadic, only passing a particular outcrop once every year, then you would indeed add to it (casually or in some important ritual) every year, to mark that you'd been there. Or whatever. Does that not sound feasible?
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