moss
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Blair resigns
May 27, 2015, 16:07
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There is really nothing to say but rejoice that this man has been called to account at last...
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/may/27/tony-blair-resigns-as-middle-east-peace-envoy-report
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Sanctuary
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Re: Blair resigns
May 27, 2015, 17:06
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moss wrote:
What you said Moss...
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grufty jim
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Re: Blair resigns
May 27, 2015, 18:18
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moss wrote: There is really nothing to say but rejoice that this man has been called to account at last...
Called to account? All that's happened is he's resigned from a position he should never have held in the first place. And the main reason for his resignation appears to be the fact that he's earning too much money from his Middle East business connections and the whole shameful spectacle has become too obvious a conflict of interest. Hardly a calling to account.
For Blair to be called to account it would need to involve an appearance at a War Crimes Tribunal. I won't be holding my breath.
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moss
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Re: Blair resigns
May 27, 2015, 21:02
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"For Blair to be called to account it would need to involve an appearance at a War Crimes Tribunal. I won't be holding my breath."
No one will, it is naive to believe that white middle aged middle class men would ever condemn one of their own to a war tribunal. Blair is a weak, greedy, self delusional idiot, unfortunately he has powerful friends elsewhere. Is the Chilcot Enquiry finished yet?
For me, Blair is no longer the problem, it is the Palestinian people, the rubble of broken houses, the frightened children, that terrible wall, the humiliation that is thrust on the people of Palestine on a daily basis. That is the immediate problem as is the hundreds of thousands refugees that swarm over the borders of Syria and Iraq. Find answers to that and don't squander millions on one man in a court of law, he is not important anymore, let the wolves of Fleet Street tear him apart.
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dhajjieboy
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Re: Blair resigns
May 27, 2015, 21:24
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You know, if you buried Tony with just his ass cheeks sticking out of the ground at the local library......
He'd make a useful bicycle parking rack.
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grufty jim
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Re: Blair resigns
May 27, 2015, 21:30
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I disagree. I don't see it as an either/or zero-sum situation... either we deal with serious injustices like Palestine; or else we hold criminals to account, but we can't do both.
We can (and should) do both.
So long as western leaders can act with impunity in ways that see non-western leaders facing charges at The Hague, then the underlying causes of the world's great injustices will never be addressed, whether that be Palestine or anywhere else.
One of the two great (and I'd argue, fatal) flaws in modern democracy is the complete failure of the system to hold individuals and governments properly to account for the things they do in power. If they can act without real consequence* then we are guaranteed more situations like Palestine, or Iraq, or Syria.
So I agree that the likes of Bush and Blair will never be punished by the systems they helped shape and define. I understand the despair and the resigned pessimism. But I don't agree with your assertion that Blair "is not important anymore".
People like Blair (or Thatcher, for instance) retain their importance - in my view - because they become powerful symbols. And it matters hugely how we treat such symbols. The very fact that Blair is still taken seriously by the western establishment sends a pointed and unambiguous message to the rest of the world. If that were to change, it would arguably be more important than any single policy change or Palestinian initiative. IMO.
* getting voted out after half a decade with a massive pension and a half-dozen "executive directorships" doesn't really count as a negative consequence in my view.
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tjj
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Re: Blair resigns
May 27, 2015, 22:22
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http://newsthump.com/2015/05/27/tony-blair-resigns-in-glory-after-bringing-peace-to-the-middle-east/
Also a rumour FIFA are interested in offering him a position ...
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moss
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Re: Blair resigns
May 27, 2015, 22:39
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As always succinct in your argument Grufty Jim, and I agree the public humiliation of a trial for Blair would both be symbolic and justice would have its day, but we both just know it is not going to happen, and so I reserve the right to be pessimistic. But for one moment today I felt joy that Blair stripped of his job as a 'peacemaker' would be vulnerable to be taken apart. Which is childish I know, because the system is not going to change, he is just another rotten apple in the barrel......
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Moon Cat
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Re: Blair resigns
May 27, 2015, 23:17
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A start of sorts, and very welcome, though hardly an act of contrition really.
When you get Cheney and Rumsfeld on the block, then we're talking. And Dubya of course, though he always seemed like a muppet for those two. Cheney, in particular, is up there with some of the worst historical figures I'd say.
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tjj
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Re: Blair resigns
May 27, 2015, 23:36
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Moon Cat wrote: A start of sorts, and very welcome, though hardly an act of contrition really.
When you get Cheney and Rumsfeld on the block, then we're talking. And Dubya of course, though he always seemed like a muppet for those two. Cheney, in particular, is up there with some of the worst historical figures I'd say.
We all know that will never happen though - they will live out their lives and die the old men they already are. I've gone past anger and the need for 'revenge' justice - they will die, as we all one day will. There is no Maker to meet ...
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