Merrick
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Re: CS Gas at Peaceful Protest
Feb 14, 2011, 11:45
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keith a wrote: Because surely they'd risk losing their jobs. How many people would be prepared to do that in this day and age?
Like anyone, they think their side is the right one and so want a good outcome for them. As such, they are biased in their thinking about others from their side, and many are not above exerting undue influence or acting in a consciously dishonest way.
Especially if there's a cosy relationship between the police and the IPCC and a personal familiarity, it is very easy to ask what's happening and express an opinion in a way that prejudices a case.
Police lie and go against their sworn duty all the time. I have been involved in several dozen court cases and around many more, well into three figures. In the majority of cases police have exaggerated and misled with their evidence, and on numerous occasions given false testimony.
The police response to the cases we all know about such as Ian Tomlinson and Jean Charles de Menezes should be enough to show anyone what happens when they've done something wrong.
keith a wrote: We'll have to agree to disagree. The 0.8% you quote is misleading. That refers to IPCC involvement, not any investigation.
In what way is that misleading? I've made clear, that's the oes that are independently investigated.
keith a wrote: The rest - the minor complaints - are investigated by the police force concerned.
Doesn't that bother you? Thousands of complainants appeal against local police investigation of themselves, but over 80% of the appeals fail and even though the complainant believes the police are not fit to investigate themselves, they almost always get to do it anyway. With predicatable results.
keith a wrote: I would have thought that some knowledge of policing would be essential somewhere along the line.
Knowledge of policing and what the police are supposed to do and what they're not allowed to do should be a prerequisite, absolutely. That doesn't mean someone who has actually done the job.
[/quote]And whilst I understand why you say "the only background that should exclude an independent investigator is one in the police" sometimes it takes a poacher to catch a poacher.[/quote]
That's just nonsense in this context. The fact that the police exonerate themselves several times more often than when they're independently investigated points towards that. Should people only be magistrates if they've got criminal convictions?
This is a matter of justice, and for justice to work it has to be clearly fairly administered. This system clearly does not do that. The police investigating themselves is like MPs deciding their own pay rises and sorting out their own expenses.
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keith a
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Edited Feb 14, 2011, 15:01
Re: CS Gas at Peaceful Protest
Feb 14, 2011, 13:21
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Merrick wrote:
Like anyone, they think their side is the right one and so want a good outcome for them. As such, they are biased in their thinking about others from their side, and many are not above exerting undue influence or acting in a consciously dishonest way.
As is often the case, this is based on prejudice and assumption rather than facts.
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drewbhoy
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Re: CS Gas at Peaceful Protest
Feb 14, 2011, 13:37
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The Sea Cat wrote: Thanks Drew. I don't have a problem with different viewpoints, even if they are completely opposed to mine. It's the personal insults and nastiness that often happens here that is a shame.
You are welcome, there was no need for his comments. Let arseholes be arseholes! (they are full of shit anyway!) Good points are all that is required and as a bonus you get the Scottish slant from me.
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geoffrey_prime
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Re: CS Gas at Peaceful Protest
Feb 15, 2011, 03:12
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Merrick, I am mindful of my delicate position, politically on this board. I do appreciate the general position, politically, of the majority of people who post on this board,,,I respect their positions...and in no way wish to force change of their views.
I would only post now on a subject I feel strongly about, or a more politically-neutral subject which may be up for wider discussion.
If I really wanted to wind up folks on this board.. I would be posting, frantically, every night...and I am not....because< i have no interest in doing that.
I may have been a little provocative in my earlier postings, but anything I have posted recently, has been genuinely, because, that's my opinion.
I don't set out to be insulting, but, I will reciprocate, where folks are being abusive to me.
I am not going to reply to the recent posts against me on this thread, Sea Cats (edit!) in particular, because I think we prob. have better things to do...and I learn as I go along.
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The Sea Cat
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Re: CS Gas at Peaceful Protest
Feb 15, 2011, 08:51
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My edit was for considered clarity only.
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mojojojo
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Re: CS Gas at Peaceful Protest
Feb 15, 2011, 09:11
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How's your delight at so many public sector jobs going Geoffrey? They all deserve it, eh? You must be a happy man!
You don't post things to wind people up...ffs. That means you meant it.
x
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geoffrey_prime
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Re: CS Gas at Peaceful Protest
Feb 17, 2011, 01:35
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mojojojo wrote: How's your delight at so many public sector jobs going Geoffrey? They all deserve it, eh? You must be a happy man!
What on earth makes you say that? ...I have spent over 10 years working in the public sector.
You don't post things to wind people up...ffs. That means you meant it.
Well, if you are being "wound up"..its only my opinion..I can't help how you feel about what I post..
x
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geoffrey_prime
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Re: CS Gas at Peaceful Protest
Feb 17, 2011, 01:39
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Now this is a "wind up"..wtf does that mean? (edit)
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The Sea Cat
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Re: CS Gas at Peaceful Protest
Feb 17, 2011, 08:35
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Meaning the only reason I edited my post was to rethink the text to make sure that my point was clear.
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Toni Torino
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Re: CS Gas at Peaceful Protest
Feb 17, 2011, 10:59
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Reading the news of the Bahrain Tear-gassing got me to wondering; Bahrain has never has civil unrest before, as far as I know, so why had the authorities stockpiled Tear-gas? As a contingency? What weapons do our authorities have stockpiled still against its citizens? Are there still rubber bullets in government warehouses over here?
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