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Time to stop solstice stones access
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nigelswift
8112 posts

Re: King Arthur responds
Mar 04, 2015, 12:11
Mustard wrote:

Not that I have much time for the mystic monarch, but he does have a point. Polarised on both sides, in my experience - total denial of problems from the solstice brigade, and total disdain for the solstice brigade from certain quarters. Be nice to see some productive dialogue instead of entrenched camps hurling stones at one another.



Except that no-one could have been more reasonable or constructive!
https://heritageaction.wordpress.com/2015/03/03/king-arthur-slams-the-heritage-journal/
Mustard
1043 posts

Re: King Arthur responds
Mar 04, 2015, 12:34
nigelswift wrote:
Mustard wrote:

Not that I have much time for the mystic monarch, but he does have a point. Polarised on both sides, in my experience - total denial of problems from the solstice brigade, and total disdain for the solstice brigade from certain quarters. Be nice to see some productive dialogue instead of entrenched camps hurling stones at one another.



Except that no-one could have been more reasonable or constructive!
https://heritageaction.wordpress.com/2015/03/03/king-arthur-slams-the-heritage-journal/


Not convinced that that's *entirely* constructive, but no desire to bicker ;)
juamei
juamei
2013 posts

Re: King Arthur responds
Mar 04, 2015, 14:27
Mustard wrote:
nigelswift wrote:
Mustard wrote:

Not that I have much time for the mystic monarch, but he does have a point. Polarised on both sides, in my experience - total denial of problems from the solstice brigade, and total disdain for the solstice brigade from certain quarters. Be nice to see some productive dialogue instead of entrenched camps hurling stones at one another.



Except that no-one could have been more reasonable or constructive!
https://heritageaction.wordpress.com/2015/03/03/king-arthur-slams-the-heritage-journal/


Not convinced that that's *entirely* constructive, but no desire to bicker ;)


I think the discrepancy is that HA want what's best for the prehistory, the druids want that but alongside and as part of 24 hour access, privileged access etc etc. HA just want the damage to stop, total disdain would be to only insist on solstice access being stopped.
Mustard
1043 posts

Re: King Arthur responds
Mar 04, 2015, 15:56
juamei wrote:
Mustard wrote:
nigelswift wrote:
Mustard wrote:

Not that I have much time for the mystic monarch, but he does have a point. Polarised on both sides, in my experience - total denial of problems from the solstice brigade, and total disdain for the solstice brigade from certain quarters. Be nice to see some productive dialogue instead of entrenched camps hurling stones at one another.



Except that no-one could have been more reasonable or constructive!
https://heritageaction.wordpress.com/2015/03/03/king-arthur-slams-the-heritage-journal/


Not convinced that that's *entirely* constructive, but no desire to bicker ;)


I think the discrepancy is that HA want what's best for the prehistory, the druids want that but alongside and as part of 24 hour access, privileged access etc etc. HA just want the damage to stop, total disdain would be to only insist on solstice access being stopped.


That's quite a subjective view though. They want what "they" think is best for prehistory. Also, if we were simply going to concern ourselves with what's best for prehistory, every site would be hermetically sealed under a dome. Seeing as nobody is calling for that, we presumably accept the principle that such sites exist within a social context where access and engagement are accepted. That being the case, nobody is arguing "against" a concern for prehistory - just disagreeing over how the balance is best struck.
juamei
juamei
2013 posts

Re: King Arthur responds
Mar 04, 2015, 16:45
Mustard wrote:
juamei wrote:
Mustard wrote:
nigelswift wrote:
Mustard wrote:

Not that I have much time for the mystic monarch, but he does have a point. Polarised on both sides, in my experience - total denial of problems from the solstice brigade, and total disdain for the solstice brigade from certain quarters. Be nice to see some productive dialogue instead of entrenched camps hurling stones at one another.



Except that no-one could have been more reasonable or constructive!
https://heritageaction.wordpress.com/2015/03/03/king-arthur-slams-the-heritage-journal/


Not convinced that that's *entirely* constructive, but no desire to bicker ;)


I think the discrepancy is that HA want what's best for the prehistory, the druids want that but alongside and as part of 24 hour access, privileged access etc etc. HA just want the damage to stop, total disdain would be to only insist on solstice access being stopped.


That's quite a subjective view though. They want what "they" think is best for prehistory. Also, if we were simply going to concern ourselves with what's best for prehistory, every site would be hermetically sealed under a dome. Seeing as nobody is calling for that, we presumably accept the principle that such sites exist within a social context where access and engagement are accepted. That being the case, nobody is arguing "against" a concern for prehistory - just disagreeing over how the balance is best struck.


Not sure I get your point here... its all gone a little academic and hypothetical. I dont accept that access to the stones is a given, if they are continually trashed then it must be made clear that the reason is because of continued access. I'd be more than happy for access to continue if and only if a compromise is reached that stops the damage. I've not seen a plausible compromise suggested yet that doesnt prohibit access in one way or another.
tjj
tjj
3606 posts

Re: King Arthur responds
Mar 04, 2015, 18:04
nigelswift wrote:
This account by a senior officer really needs airing far and wide.


"I would like to add my thoughts to the debate about open access to the Stones at Solstice.I would prefer to be anonymous for professional reasons.

I have attended several of the summer Solstice events in a professional capacity as a senior officer in one of the statutory emergency services. I have witnessed first hand the heartbreak that the staff feel when they reclaim the area within the circle the morning after. I have seen guardians in tears at the insults wrought to the monument, the appalling stench, the rubbish, the vandalism, beer cans wedged into cracks in the stones, urine, vomit and faeces everywhere.
The majority seems to have little care for an ancient monument, and utterly disrespect it.
One member of staff (NT or EH, can’t remember), whilst starting to collect the detritus, in tears, muttered “364 days a year we protect and care for this place, 364 days a year, and then this happens in one night”. But they always manage to clear the rubbish up and get the site open again. The smell lingers, though, for days."


It must be soul destroying to have to go through this every year - the situation is unsustainable and has to change or evolve.

I was less than complimentary about 'King Arthur' yesterday mainly because I find his self proclaimed 'royal' persona irritating. Didn't want to do him an injustice though so read through the Wikipedia entry for him.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Uther_Pendragon
It is impressive - he has done a lot and done it bravely. That doesn't make him always right though. To me it seems the entry fee to Stonehenge is over-priced. It should be kept under £10, people wanting to visit at Solstice should have to pay the same fee - with a limited number places available. Let the Druids have their rituals - after they've paid the entry fee like everyone else.

There is open access to the land around Stonehenge so any one who wants to can still see the sunrise only just a little bit further away - perhaps that's what the Cursus was meant for.
tiompan
tiompan
5758 posts

Re: King Arthur responds
Mar 04, 2015, 19:41
Coincidentally he appears in the recently mentioned “H is for hawk “ . the author , giving a eulogy at a memorial service for her father describes a trip to Cornwall to observe the eclipse of the sun with her father , a distinguished press photographer ,
“ A man who said he was the reincarnation of King Arthur Arthur , a man wearing a silver diadem and long white robes ,came up to dad , and said , bewildered , 'why are you wearing that suit ? ' Well said Dad , you never know you are going to meet . “
http://www.pressgazette.co.uk/node/37197
Howburn Digger
Howburn Digger
986 posts

Re: King Arthur responds
Mar 04, 2015, 21:07
tjj wrote:
To me it seems the entry fee to Stonehenge is over-priced. It should be kept under £10, people wanting to visit at Solstice should have to pay the same fee - with a limited number places available. Let the Druids have their rituals - after they've paid the entry fee like everyone else.


The price of seeing The Stonehenge should be kept to under 10p (for those who actually want to pay). Every sightseer should be compelled to line up in height order though. The visitors should them be made to approach the stones in line with their eyes closed and then limited to no more than a minute of viewing (in case their eyes suck in too much of "Ye Magik Of Ye Stonehenge". They can open their eyes on the way back but not turn around and look again (anyone doing so should be forced to dance a samba while being jeered and mocked by judges from Strictly Come Dancing).

Those who decide to contribute a sum (of no more than 10p) should be personally thanked by someone dressed in a D'Oily Carte Light Opera Company admiral's uniform (the "admiral" can be a lady or a gentleman but they must be wearing a monocle). Those monies collected should be directed to National Organisations like "Riding For The Confused", "Save The Wasp" and "Woodwork For The Short-As-Two-Thick-Planks".
nigelswift
8112 posts

Re: King Arthur responds
Mar 05, 2015, 06:07
Mustard wrote:

They want what "they" think is best for prehistory.

I read the various Free Access websites. There's hardly any talk of that. It's all playground stuff about defeating EH and regaining the stones for the people.
tjj
tjj
3606 posts

Re: King Arthur responds
Mar 05, 2015, 08:42
Howburn Digger wrote:
tjj wrote:
To me it seems the entry fee to Stonehenge is over-priced. It should be kept under £10, people wanting to visit at Solstice should have to pay the same fee - with a limited number places available. Let the Druids have their rituals - after they've paid the entry fee like everyone else.


The price of seeing The Stonehenge should be kept to under 10p (for those who actually want to pay). Every sightseer should be compelled to line up in height order though. The visitors should them be made to approach the stones in line with their eyes closed and then limited to no more than a minute of viewing (in case their eyes suck in too much of "Ye Magik Of Ye Stonehenge". They can open their eyes on the way back but not turn around and look again (anyone doing so should be forced to dance a samba while being jeered and mocked by judges from Strictly Come Dancing).

Those who decide to contribute a sum (of no more than 10p) should be personally thanked by someone dressed in a D'Oily Carte Light Opera Company admiral's uniform (the "admiral" can be a lady or a gentleman but they must be wearing a monocle). Those monies collected should be directed to National Organisations like "Riding For The Confused", "Save The Wasp" and "Woodwork For The Short-As-Two-Thick-Planks".


Hahaha! Such a witty response deserves a witty reply ... hope someone comes up with one.
I had my eyes opened about Stonehenge last summer when with a friend I walked from Woodhenge, following the helpful interpretation panels along the way. The best views of Stonehenge are from some distance off, following the route of the Avenue uphill is a worthwhile experience. I felt a bit sorry for the hundreds of visitors, many of whom had been brought by coach, to pay nearly £15 a time and yet they were missing out of the 'hidden' Stonehenge - which is actually free and and in clear view. From the landscape it looks down on.
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