BlueGloves
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Re: You're a skeptic
Sep 08, 2003, 20:55
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Thanks !
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Steve Gray
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Re: You're a skeptic
Sep 09, 2003, 00:18
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If you look back to the beginning of the thread you'll find that Rhiannon said "(fourwinds leave me alone)".
Austin replied, "thanks pal .I will be ignoring the sceptics .life`s too short".
So before any of us said anything derogatory, Austin had already stated his unwillingness to talk to anyone who does not share his blind faith. In doing so he actually set himself up for reprisals from skeptics. Such biggotry is hardly deserving of consideration and kindness on a forum that's here for the purpose of debate and the sharing information. Even if someone does not share your views, it is rude to say "I'm going to ignore you".
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morfe lux
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Re: You're a skeptic
Sep 09, 2003, 01:44
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I think it's at points like these we realise the inadequacy of the typewritten word ;-)
I take the point, but I have seen people get scared off here pretty quick by some rather rude and short retorts, I wouldn't be at all suprised if McSherry (hate to speak for absentees) was just covering his/her back by saying they would 'ignore'. Came over to me like "I shan't mind the insults too much".
Anyhow, just my 2 English pence.
PS: we can't 'debate' on the forum, cos FW said so :-(
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FourWinds
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Re: You're a skeptic
Sep 09, 2003, 06:53
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Your Morfeness,
You know very well that I meant this is not an area to try and gain 'political advantages' through 'debating society level' tactics. Or I hope you do, anyway.
Too many topics on here go the way of one side stating facts and the other stating their version and ne'er the twain shall meet. What's worse is that when these debating threads happen there's never any attempt at coming to a consensus. I realise that this is impossible all the time, but surely not every time.
The stone sifting threads have been exemplarary. Lots of give and take between folks with different ideas. I know that's not about a major item of popular belief with two polar camps involved, but it's been refreshing.
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jimit
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Re: You're a skeptic
Sep 09, 2003, 08:18
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Read recently (Torygraph,Grauniad?) about experiments done in the Royal Albert Hall with musicians playing instruments which produce infrasound ie. wavelengths below 50Htz. Many listners reported unusual sensations/feelings/emotions. The article suggested that perhaps this is why some people have mystical experiences in churches when the organ is playing extremely low notes.
More pertinent to our point, perhaps underground water produces a low frequency "rumble" which is picked up and magnified by the nerves/muscles and shown by the movement of the dowsing rods>
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BrigantesNation
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Re: You're a skeptic
Sep 09, 2003, 10:59
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But the point is, dowsing can be used to detect underground tunnels, minerals, filled in ditches and the likes, dowsing does not just work for water.
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FourWinds
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Re: You're a skeptic
Sep 09, 2003, 11:10
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And all those things you mention have a small local effect on the Earth's magnetic field.
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nigelswift
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Re: You're a skeptic
Sep 09, 2003, 12:59
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I reckon there are two threads here - "scientific" dowsing that's probably testable and explicable, and then there's what I suspect Mr Mcsherry meant - leys, grids etc that are beyond the scientific possibilities mentioned here. Some people trace complex spirals and lines at every site, so presumably that's not water or electro magnetism as I understand it.
I've never dowsed scientifically, but I have done some of the other sort, with excellent results. In my own case, and without speaking for anyone else, I think it's down to the sub-conscious me, that wants it to work, forcing the conscious me to tip the rods downwards almost imperceptably at certain moments. A tiny adjustment can precipitate a huge swing. An observer could never tell that I'm doing it, in fact I can barely know myself, so there's plenty of room for both self-delusion and charlatanism.
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jimit
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Re: You're a skeptic
Sep 09, 2003, 14:16
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I know that dowsing does "work" for things other than water, my point was that if we are looking for a "scientific" explanation for the effect, infrasound is worthwhile thinking about. Tunnels especially might emit low frequency waves due to slight earth movements.
BTW I have tried dowsing with some curious results!
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Steve Gray
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Re: You're a skeptic
Sep 09, 2003, 14:19
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Infra-sound is reasonably well known to produce effects at certain frequencies, some of them quite distressing (nausea, pain, etc). There was an experiment in France several decades ago to investigate these effects. They found that a frequency of 7Hz produced the most extreme effect on humans. There was even a suggestion that it could be used as a weapon. Some rooms can exhibit infra-sound resonances that can be stimulated by noises in the environment or by wind. People can feel ill or uneasy in such rooms (maybe halucinate too?).
Although most dowsers walk fairly gently over the ground, I suppose that it's just possible that they are producing seismic impulses with their feet and then somehow detecting the return "echos". That's pure speculation, though.
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