sanshee
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Re: Yes, it's important this time
May 08, 2012, 20:33
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anthonyqkiernan wrote:
sanshee wrote:
It's racist
No it's not
Really?
http://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/political-news/legal-bid-over-snp-university-fees-move.1328151823
I don't get the 'Scotland don't vote Tory' argument as a reason to support this lot either.
This isn't about 'policies', it's about ripping up a constitution. Creating borders and all that. Tailspinning a whole cultural identity.
Do you really think team Salmond, Sturgeon et al have the capacity to understand what the fuck that means? Or to even care?
I mean seriously?
I don't like 'nationalists', and I'd hoped the more thoughtful amonst us would feel the same way.
And besided, do the people of Wales, England and Northern Ireland get to vote on a breaking up of the UK?
They do all live there too ya know.
And if not, why not?
Oh wait coz a bunch of 'nationalists' says so.
Get them to fuck, Really.
x
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sanshee
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Edited May 08, 2012, 20:37
Re: Yes, it's important this time
May 08, 2012, 20:35
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John Rice wrote:
I don't think it's about whether the Westminster government is left or right, but about the fact that it clearly doesn't have any correlation with the way the Scottish people vote. And hasn't had for the majority of my life, and I suspect most people reading this.
Of course, it's not like modern democracy really works for any of us, but in the case of Scotland, the failure is particularly blatant.
Eh, we've voted Labour for years up here. That went tits up of course, then the backlash. But it's all very recent, don't think otherwise. You'd be wrong.
x
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John Rice
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Re: Yes, it's important this time
May 08, 2012, 21:36
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sanshee wrote: Eh, we've voted Labour for years up here. That went tits up of course, then the backlash. But it's all very recent, don't think otherwise. You'd be wrong.
x
Not sure what you're suggesting I am, or would be, wrong about. I never suggested that Scotland was inherently left wing, just that they never voted tory. In 1955 the tories won 50% of Scottish seats. Since then the trend has been resolutely downwards (1964 was the last time they secured even a third of Scottish seats). Not sure I'd call that a "very recent" development.
Anyway, as I've already said, I have no truck with nationalists. I just think that there's absolutely nothing wrong with the Scottish people exercising their legal right to vote on the issue (a right that has already been implicitly endorsed by Welsh and English voters when they voted overwhelmingly for a Labour manifesto that promised devolution and the right to a referendum). And were I Scottish, I would vote in favour of independence for the reasons I've already stated. That's all.
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anthonyqkiernan
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Re: Yes, it's important this time
May 09, 2012, 10:39
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Eduardo wrote: What's wrong with just increasing the extent of devolution
Absolutely nothing. But, every time it's put before an English electorate they reject it. So, are the Scots meant to wait for you all to agree first? I think you'll find that's the problem to start with
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anthonyqkiernan
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Edited May 09, 2012, 11:02
Re: Yes, it's important this time
May 09, 2012, 10:43
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sanshee wrote: And besided, do the people of Wales, England and Northern Ireland get to vote on a breaking up of the UK?
If the issue is with decisions being made 'elsewhere' what's the point in that? (Let's ignore the fact, I think there'd be a resounding 'Yes' at the moment.)
sanshee wrote:
"tuition fee arrangements are based on domicile not nationality." Or, even, 'race'
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Moon Cat
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Re: Yes, it's important this time
May 10, 2012, 18:02
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anthonyqkiernan wrote: Eduardo wrote: What's wrong with just increasing the extent of devolution
Absolutely nothing. But, every time it's put before an English electorate they reject it. So, are the Scots meant to wait for you all to agree first? I think you'll find that's the problem to start with
Just out of Devil's advocation - given the predominance of high profile and often popular Scottish and Welsh ministers (even Prime Ministers!) in Westminster over the decades and beyond, do you think an Independent Scotland would welcome an Englishman as a party leader or 1st Minister if such a scenario occured?
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geoffrey_prime
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Re: Yes, it's important this time
May 24, 2012, 03:43
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So, put yourself up for election then..
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geoffrey_prime
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Re: Yes, it's important this time
May 24, 2012, 03:47
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"sheep".. who's going to try and actually change anything?
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Moon Cat
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Re: Yes, it's important this time
May 24, 2012, 15:59
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Those years at Finishing School didn't really pay off in the end did they?
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Welsh Andy
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Re: Yes, it's important this time
May 25, 2012, 12:01
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Hi, I'm new here. I registered for the archaeological side of the site but my first comment is on a political thread. :/ erk
I've lived in Scotland for most of the last 11 years and, whilst I'm not a nationalist, I will be voting in the referendum and voting for independence. My reasons for doing so are quite different from most people though I feel.
I have to say, first, that nationalists of all stripes irk me no end. From the naive romanticism of the 'shortbread' nationalists to the rabid racism of a minority and the bizarreness of the left wing nationalists; they can all, as is the phrase up here, 'get tae fuck'.
But I will still be voting for independence. Why? Because I want to see the Daily Mail spontaneously combust. Because I want to watch the Loyal Orange Lodge have a collective seizure. Because these things will be hilarious. independence for the lulz. Any other justification for a yes vote is nonsense. :)
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