Daminxa
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Re: so gay?
Oct 22, 2004, 15:14
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No? Well at least you gave it a go!
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superboss
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Re: so gay?
Oct 22, 2004, 17:04
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!!!! i couldn't eat a whole one!!!!
its like therapy on here init!
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Lord Lucan
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Re: so gay?
Oct 29, 2004, 10:49
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"Isn't there much more important things to worry about?"
Maybe to you, mate. But to me as a gay man it is important, OK? If you don't give a toss then fine. I do though, so please respect the fact that somethimes things you find unimportant actually have more resonance with others.
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Lord Lucan
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Re: so gay?
Oct 29, 2004, 11:04
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I'm in total agreement with you on the issue of knowing when you are gay. My stock response to the dumb and depressingly inevitable question that many straight people often end up asking me at some point after I've got to know them, ie: "When did you realise you were gay?" has for years now been met with the question: "When did you realise you were straight?" That normally makes them realise how dumb they're being and makes them think.
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morfe
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more important.
Oct 29, 2004, 11:15
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S'ok m'lud, I'm sure our aggrieved commenter would come to understand if comments such as "you're so, like, BORED..." become generalised in the pejorative fashion ;-)
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Lord Lucan
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Re: so gay?
Oct 29, 2004, 11:20
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The reappropriation of terms like this by us queers is a way of neutralising their negative connotations. However, used by straight people in a similarly jokey way doesn't work and still has the whiff of prejudice and 'you are 'other'' about it. Just like a white person calling a black person 'nigger' will always be beyond reasonable use, although the black community use it freely amongst themselves.
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Lord Lucan
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Re: more important.
Oct 29, 2004, 11:23
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Ha!
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Lord Lucan
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Re: so gay?
Oct 29, 2004, 12:03
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My 2p-worth on this....
(This is all in the context of its current use in the UK, not the US, by the way)
Of course it's negative.
The usage is intended to highlight the effeminacy and generally stereotypical idea of what gay men are in the context of someone's behaviour/demeanour etc. And is designed to call a heterosexual's sexuality into question, which is a guaranteed way to insult many of them (particularly kids/adolescents unfortunately).
You don't find it said in a 'Wow! That's soooo gay' way that sounds positive and affirming. If it was being used by gay people themselves then perhaps there would be a case for arguing it's a reappropriation thing. But it isn't. The way this is used (in the UK) is homophobic, and to pretend otherwise is just wilfully ignoring the obvious to my mind. OK, so its not on the same level as 'I fucking hate queers', but it's another of those more insidious and subtle forms of prejudice that because of its mild nature those who aren't directly affected by it can claim (as someone did above) that it's unimportant. Well, to me as a gay man casual homophobia is important. It betrays an underlying unease at the 'otherness' of gay people whilst pretending to still be tolerant. And worst of all, it perpetuates the myths and perceptions of those ignorant straight people that the sterotypical effeminate man is still the embodiment of the quintessential gay man. Allow pejorative usage like this, however mild, to continue unquestioned, particularly in the young who are developing the next generation's attitudes, and we allow prejudice to be perpetuated.
I, and other gay friends of mine, have had to wage a bit of a war against the word 'poof' being used as a casual insult too. It's interesting that it's only EVER used that way by straight people. Gay people never really use it, and it's often used by straight people directly at gay people in a jokey way. Thing is I don't like it and don't find it jokey, and it oversteps the mark with me. A friend of mine years ago quickly learnt not to call me a poof when I ranted at him when he did it. Initally he thought I was over-reacting, but when I explained that hearing that word in a negative context in reference to gay people all the time when you're growing up as a gay person means that it just provokes an automatic emotional response that feels like you've been punched in the guts (this is hard to describe to someone who won't ever get this feeling). He apologised and said it was just a casual expression he'd grown up with. I said that was no excuse. He's never used it again. This has happened several times since, and I make no apology for it. People need to be told. Oh, and I wish people would at least learn to spell the word properly! It's 'poof', not 'puff', m'kay?!
/...sermon over.../
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Spaceship mark
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Re: so gay?
Oct 29, 2004, 13:33
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Crikey that brings back memories. There was a kid at our school called 'Tefal' and I'm sure I was as guilty as anyone else in using the term 'Joey' as derogatory term.
I find it a bit odd that the tongue-between-teeth-and-lower-lip fuelled 'urrrr', that used to accompany the calling someone a 'joey' or a 'spakka', seems to have made a comeback. Thankfully not the slapping of a limp left hand with the right hand (or was that just a blackpool thing?).
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Daminxa
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Re: so gay?
Oct 29, 2004, 19:45
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No, that was a Croydon thing too!
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