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The Modern Antiquarian Forum » Stone Circle between Avebury and Marlborough |
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Sanctuary 4670 posts |
Mar 05, 2013, 21:44
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harestonesdown wrote: Sanctuary wrote: harestonesdown wrote: Sanctuary wrote: bladup wrote: harestonesdown wrote: bladup wrote: harestonesdown wrote: bladup wrote: harestonesdown wrote: bladup wrote: harestonesdown wrote: bladup wrote: harestonesdown wrote: bladup wrote: by saying that everything people feel at these places is just in their heads, I don't think he said/meant that Paul, maybe a misinterpretation ? Either way, maybe just agree to disagree ? I've never agreed with him ever, so we always have to agree to disagree but i don't think you can misunderstand - " I have a suspicion that there is a genuine placebo effect at work at many circles whether old or modern, arising from a pleasing proportionality", if he doesn't feel anything, how can anyone else? it's just silly, he's saying the feeling you sometimes get at circles is just because the stones are in a pleasing shape, that's more in your gardening world geoff than anything to do with the position of stone circles that mark real circles in the landscape, at stone circles the land gives the impression of spiraling into the circle and the circle is always just off center, the position is already in the landscape, he seems to be saying that they're just a pleasing on the eye circle of stones, thats it, i'm just wondering what interests him then, as there's no mystery to him at all, I for one "feel" all the ritual that went on at these places, my lad has always had the same thing, he was only 3 when he wouldn't go into the Druid's circle because of what he said went on to children there!!! [he'd not heard me say anything about the place, i'd not even been before]. Paul, you have a certain "passion" and views that most wouldn't subscribe to, i don't myself, and whilst i do agree the sites are "special" each individual will interpret that in their own way as you do. With respect your interpretation is waaaaay out there compared to most and whilst i respect your views i can't subscribe to them. I guess my views in your eyes would come across as passionless in comparison, though that doesn't mean being at a special place has no meaning to me, it does, which answers your question ie "why bother" ? I'm not having a dig mate, just saying we're all different. I doubt there's anyone using this site that's had more "run ins" with the membership than myself, some of them very intense but ultimately it serves nothing bar earning you a ban and a lost voice, which none of us want, but you can bet your bottom dollar the mods will show you the door if you don't stop taking things so personal, which you do ! Take a leaf from my book, you have to let things go or your head will explode. :) My first comment [i see nothing wrong at all] - " At least she has faith in something, If someone stands in Stonehenge on their own and "feels" nothing, i'd say that person has no soul, This is madness - do you really think that everything people feel at these places is just Placebo? With your interest on the subject i don't think you really do, is this the self proclaimed "troublemaker" at work again?" Do you?, and i'll just be myself [i am what i am] and let them tell me if they've got a problem not you, talk about the pot calling the kettle black, i'll never be nowhere near as bad as you [and i read some of the nasty homophobic stuff], your not the right person to tell anyone how to behave on here. I may not be as sprightly as yourself these days Paul but i invite you to call me homophobic to my face, over the solstice. ? Now put your dummy back in and grow up ffs, you really do yourself no favours with this attitude, nor the site. I read it and the Ed's certainly thought it was you, I read Goffik been abused and Moth and Jane, it was horrible reading Goffik's because i remember thinking your not just abusing him here but all Gays reading as well, you say it wasn't you, but it was your Megadread name used, i have my doubts [as the Ed's do], and i'd dare say anything to anyones face, but that would only happen if me and mine gets abused, then you'd see, try it!!! Ok i'll bite, one last time. Going on the megameet picks Goff certainly isn't gay. :) Moth and Jane ? as i asked before give me one single reason i'd have any sort of problem with either ? Guess you aren't aware i often see posts on Facebook through mutual friends i could respond to in any way i chose if i cared to. :) Let me make this clear for you, I'VE NEVER HAD NOR HAVE ANY PROBLEM WITH MOTH OR JANE, you got that ? I've never tried to hide my feelings towards certain people here, whilst at the same time extending an open invitation to share my knowledege either here or in person with the same people. Thing is Paul you move on, it's the internet and people tend to act in ways they wouldn't in person, sometimes through misinterpretation, ooh there's that word again, maybe you should look it up. : ) Heads you win, tails i lose, but credit me with a little sense. ;) https://tails.boum.org/ Why you get banned then? I don't like homophobic people, i scored weed off a lovely gay man for years in Lincoln, and nobody can help how they're born, Who do you think did it in your name then! cause if it wasn't you somebody certainly had it in for you, you'd be better off admitting it and saying sorry, but i don't think you are, at all, lets just all forget how hatefilled it was and move on eh, well i don't like homophobic's, i don't think this is how you get kicked off, you get kicked off by been homophobic, it was the Ed's that told everyone what you'd done, i'm a night owl so read it myself, i wasn't born yesterday, you wouldn't believe the sort of things i got away from by leaving Lincoln, your arguing with the wrong sort of person. Do you still think (as previously) i have multiple accounts here ? or were you wrong in that assumption ? I'm going on reading it myself and the Ed's telling everybody what you'd said and that you'd been banned, they must have thought it was you or it's defamation of your character, and they must think you'd have no chance in court or they wouldn't have said anything [they didn't need to], i wasn't born yesterday and my little girl would see though your poor attempts at adverse psychology. Guys, you're spoiling your evening. Why don't you just stop. Opening up old wounds gets you nowhere. You're both better than this so go pick up on another thread and get out of the loop. Killjoy, i just opened a nice bottle of wine too ! (OMFG !!!) :) Are you seeing RED then :-) Sorry, got a touch of the VBB's!! Given tonight's post exchanges i totally understand your Reisling. You 4got to put 'HIC' after Reisling :-)
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thesweetcheat 6218 posts |
Mar 05, 2013, 21:45
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harestonesdown wrote: thesweetcheat wrote: Sounds like we're gonna see claret spilled tonight. (Sorry, touch of the Sweeneys). Carter understand a word of that. ! *Hic.* :) You will once you Regan consciousness.
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harestonesdown 1067 posts |
Mar 05, 2013, 21:51
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thesweetcheat wrote: harestonesdown wrote: thesweetcheat wrote: Sounds like we're gonna see claret spilled tonight. (Sorry, touch of the Sweeneys). Carter understand a word of that. ! *Hic.* :) You will once you Regan consciousness. Ooh that's bad, really bad, VBB bad. What you drinking ? Just Haskin. :D
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nigelswift 8112 posts |
Edited Mar 06, 2013, 08:56
Mar 06, 2013, 08:41
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Bladup, I thought I'd pop back and say this - All I've said on this thread is that I suspect there's “a genuine placebo effect at work at many circles whether old or modern" , an idea I've been proposing for ten years and which has generated a number of long, interesting and above all civilised TMA discussions. In response you have taken it upon yourself to say that it shows, I'm selfish, childish, off my head, have no soul and am “a bitter old man”. Bad behaviour. People have repeatedly given you a lot of latitude here because, I suspect, they think you genuinely don't know how to behave properly. You shouldn't mistake that for approval though.
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tjj 3606 posts |
Edited Mar 06, 2013, 09:10
Mar 06, 2013, 08:59
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nigelswift wrote: Bladup, I thought I'd pop back and say this - All I've said on this thread is that I suspect there's “a genuine placebo effect at work at many circles whether old or modern" , an idea I've been proposing for ten years and which has generated a number of long, interesting and above all civilised TMA discussions. In response you have taken it upon yourself to say that it shows, I'm selfish, childish, off my head, have no soul and am “a bitter old man”. Bad behaviour. People have repeatedly given you a lot of latitude here because, I suspect, they think you genuinely don't know how to behave. You shouldn't mistake that for approval though. I'm completely baffled by the way some of the discussions become so personal and insulting so quickly. I agree with your comment about 'placebo effect' although perhaps 'placebo' suggests 'not real' ... there is no doubt that the way ancient or modern sites affect us is about our own perception at the time. This can be affected by all sorts of other external conditions such as the weather, who we are with (or not), and not least our expectations. Coming upon an 'unknown' stone circle in the Wiltshire countryside must have caused surprise and delight. PS: Just to add 'placebo' was a word used by original poster and was only used by yourself in the context of your reply.
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tiompan 5758 posts |
Mar 06, 2013, 09:08
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tjj wrote: ... there is no doubt that the way ancient or modern sites affect us is about our own perception at the time. This can be affected by all sorts of other external conditions such as the weather, who we are with (or not), and not least our expectations. I broadly agree with that although you might be shocked to discover that some would view that comment as extreme and mistaken .
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tjj 3606 posts |
Mar 06, 2013, 09:15
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tiompan wrote: tjj wrote: ... there is no doubt that the way ancient or modern sites affect us is about our own perception at the time. This can be affected by all sorts of other external conditions such as the weather, who we are with (or not), and not least our expectations. I broadly agree with that although you might be shocked to discover that some would view that comment as extreme and mistaken . Not shocked Tiompan ... people do tend to project onto others what they are often guilty of themselves.
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nigelswift 8112 posts |
Edited Mar 06, 2013, 09:23
Mar 06, 2013, 09:19
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Well I thought, initially, that the problem was that placebo was being taken as "not real" but it seems offence was taken over the fact it also means "all in the mind". Of course, if you theorise that the forms of some stone circles are psychologically pleasing you are indeed saying their effect is in the mind and many people would have no problem with that. However, the anger comes, I think, from the mistaken interpretation that such a proposal is saying leylines and being able to "sense" previous "ritual activity" are fictions. It's a wrong intepretation of course because all of those things could co-exist independently - so it's bad behaviour prompted by mistaken interpretation. Having said that, I personally don't believe in leylines or an ability to sense previous ritual activity no matter how vehemently those who say they can sense them insist they can sense them and in that I am at one with 99% of the population so feel no sense of guilt about my opinion. (And as for the accusation that if I don't support the idea of woo I can't have a proper interest in circles, well....) If ever, for the first time in history, anyone shows under scientific test conditions they can find such things I'll be the first to cheer. But not until.
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Littlestone 5386 posts |
Mar 06, 2013, 09:53
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bladup wrote: ...I for one "feel" all the ritual that went on at these places... There’s nothing wrong with ‘feeling’ Mr b, and you may be receptive to things that others are not. To assume however that these places were places were ‘ritual’ went on is something of a generalization (if you’re talking about all of them that is). While some certainly were places of ritual others were perhaps no more than corrals.
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Sanctuary 4670 posts |
Mar 06, 2013, 10:27
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Littlestone wrote: bladup wrote: ...I for one "feel" all the ritual that went on at these places... There’s nothing wrong with ‘feeling’ Mr b, and you may be receptive to things that others are not. To assume however that these places were places were ‘ritual’ went on is something of a generalization (if you’re talking about all of them that is). While some certainly were places of ritual others were perhaps no more than corrals. I don't know that we can be even certain of ritual LS. Okay, one could say that sitting down to a meal every day is a ritual, but is it in the way the word ritual is associated with the Neolithic/BA for example. Other than that I completely agree with what you say. I also think Paul is very tuned in to what he believes in and it would go against his nature to be any different. A comment which of course that applies to each and every one of us.
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