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laresident
laresident
870 posts

Re: Jeremy Corbyn
Aug 18, 2015, 14:55
How nice! I had no idea International Times were still about, let alone have their finger still on the pulse. I would vote for him. The more I find out about him, the more I like him. I hope his time has come.
grufty jim
grufty jim
1978 posts

Edited Aug 18, 2015, 15:54
Re: Jeremy Corbyn
Aug 18, 2015, 15:51
thesweetcheat wrote:
To be honest the party would be better without them in the long term.


I don't disagree with that at all. But the splitting of political parties and movements is inherently unpredictable and often causes a lot of collateral damage (to everyone involved).

I've read extensively about the split between the anarchist and communist left in the mid / late 1800s (often viewed as a split between Marx and Proudhon, but it was far deeper and wider than that). In my view, it was that split which effectively ushered in the modern capitalist era. Others disagree of course (and most capitalists will sneer at such a suggestion and insist that modern capitalism was inevitable). But by ripping apart Labour Unions and revolutionary organisations at such a crucial time, I don't think any objective observer can deny the split certainly reduced the ability of socialism to offer a coherent alternative to the emerging corporate culture.

-------

EDIT: I'm well aware that the situations are very different. And this is not a split between two radical tendencies, but rather a (potential) shedding of an impediment to radicalism. But my basic point is about the inherent unpredictability of such splits. And I do worry about the fate of the NHS if Labour enters the wilderness for any period of time.

Yes, it's arguable they have already entered the wilderness. So again; let's be clear, I enthusiastically welcome a Corbyn victory and what it represents. I am simply sounding a note of caution.

I recall partying in the streets when Blair took power. So let's not get carried away, or count any chickens just yet.
moss
moss
2880 posts

Re: Jeremy Corbyn
Aug 19, 2015, 09:57
As someone who is sick of even hearing the names of the three right wing labour canditates on the radio, Monbiot is also capturing the mood of sheer disbelief as Labour squirms in its death throes.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/aug/18/jeremy-corbyn-rivals-chase-impossible-dream
spencer
spencer
3045 posts

Re: Jeremy Corbyn
Aug 19, 2015, 11:42
Thank you for that. Fifty seven pages of comments already too.
thesweetcheat
thesweetcheat
6034 posts

Re: Jeremy Corbyn
Aug 19, 2015, 12:56
That's a terrific piece, thanks Moss.

"The task is to rebuild the party’s values, reclaim the democratic debate, pull the centre back towards the left and change – as Clement Attlee and Thatcher did in different ways – the soul of the nation."
spencer
spencer
3045 posts

Shame on The Guardian
Aug 23, 2015, 03:02
For all the praise for publishing Monbiot's piece, read this regarding the rest of the papers JC coverage: http://medialens.org/index.php/alerts/alert-archive/2015/798-the-guardian-readers-editor-responds-on-jeremy-corbyn.html
moss
moss
2880 posts

Re: Shame on The Guardian
Aug 23, 2015, 08:54
spencer wrote:
For all the praise for publishing Monbiot's piece, read this regarding the rest of the papers JC coverage: http://medialens.org/index.php/alerts/alert-archive/2015/798-the-guardian-readers-editor-responds-on-jeremy-corbyn.html


I suppose you could call it a good piece of navel searching, at least someone has analysed the bias against Corbyn.
An outside runner, comes in front with the people, and all hell breaks loose in the labour party. Journalists like Polly Toynbee are running scared of the implosion of the party; the surety of a specific set of governance has been blown to the wind by Corbyn, he really is an unknown factor and he may not be able to change things as many people want.
The whole things weird, the Guardian 'allows' free speech by its journalists? or is there an editorial bias, or a level playground for all contestants?
spencer
spencer
3045 posts

Edited Aug 23, 2015, 11:42
Re: Shame on The Guardian
Aug 23, 2015, 11:36
Judging by this piece and by the sheer volume of examples of subtle or belittling anti JC statements therein there i s editorial bias, and Monbiot was a one off strident sop to try and maintain or give an illusion of cred to a readership which must have a a considerable 'pro' element while there has been a constant 'anti' undercurrent. Medialens has caught the Guardian out, and I do not think this is the first time. As for the 'Comment is Free' section, the title is bollocks, it is overseen/monitored by people who delete or do not allow posts on certain subjects that do not support their worldview, eg the ME. This has been very well documented on Craig Murray's site in the past, particularily in the comments. For some Comment is Barred.
spencer
spencer
3045 posts

Re: Jeremy Corbyn
Aug 24, 2015, 02:43
Laurie Penny nails it: http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2015/08/what-corbyn-moment-means-left
Sanctuary
Sanctuary
4787 posts

Re: Jeremy Corbyn
Sep 04, 2015, 08:04
Game, set and match?

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/labour-leadership-debate-jeremy-corbyn-025052109.html#ZF3p8oQ
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