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U-Know! Forum » The first unspinnable Brexit effect |
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nigelswift 8112 posts |
Apr 01, 2017, 07:12
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Boris says we'll "stand up for Gibraltar's interest". I think we all know what that means. Personally if sovereignty passes to Spain I couldn't care less but if that's part of the Brexit deal and it deeply upsets the Leave voters, good.
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Captain Starlet 1110 posts |
Apr 01, 2017, 14:24
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I don't think sovereignty will pass, after all the people living there voted to stay part of the UK, they also voted to stay in EU though. It's not a country I know much about so not really sure what their options are, but seems they can't support one vote and ignore the other. It's certainly a fly in the ointment for mayhem & co for which I am very glad.
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sanshee 1080 posts |
Apr 02, 2017, 10:34
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Gibraltarians want to remain 'British'. They just 'do'. Check what Picardo has to say. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dp_LAHfg2Kc The one really visible EU flag is there out of courtesy, sitting alongside the UK one and the one with the castle on it. But there are UK flags everywhere in Gibraltar, it's woven into the fabric of their society. I am no fan of flags, but there you go. Yes they overwhelmingly voted 'remain' but polls were suggesting 'remain' would win so probably thought they'd avoid the headache. Spain is just playing silly beggars.
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thesweetcheat 6210 posts |
Apr 02, 2017, 12:13
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When the saltire flies in Scotland it's unacceptable nationalism. When the union jack flies in Gibraltar it's a symbol of patriotism and nationhood. Go figure. The people of Gibraltar voted 96% remain, yet that doesn't count, whereas the 52% who voted leave have an unassailable position to be the voice of "the people". I get that they also voted 99% to stay part of Britain, but which vote counts? Both? Neither? Still looking forward to all those positive benefits of leaving the EU to be unveiled sanshee. Although at least we only have to pay half a billion quid to put a new jacket on our passports.
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sanshee 1080 posts |
Edited Apr 02, 2017, 13:46
Apr 02, 2017, 13:35
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thesweetcheat wrote: When the saltire flies in Scotland it's unacceptable nationalism. When the union jack flies in Gibraltar it's a symbol of patriotism and nationhood. Go figure. The people of Gibraltar voted 96% remain, yet that doesn't count, whereas the 52% who voted leave have an unassailable position to be the voice of "the people". I get that they also voted 99% to stay part of Britain, but which vote counts? Both? Neither? Still looking forward to all those positive benefits of leaving the EU to be unveiled sanshee. Although at least we only have to pay half a billion quid to put a new jacket on our passports. Go figure what? I said I am no fan of flags and I mean that. I have not truck with the psychology of Gibraltarians and I have no desire what so ever to even visit the place, I am just stating their position. Did you bother to look at the video clip? Here it is again. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dp_LAHfg2Kc Check the words of the bloke in charge, and he is not as far as I can tell getting any resistance from his own people. As far as Gibraltar goes being British is more important to them than being in the EU. You are shooting the messenger I'm afraid. Any delay to EU negotiations was in part brought about by an unnecessary court case, something remain voters welcomed remember. So if you want to see positive benefits you have to let the thing 'happen'. EDIT: Amusingly enough, your mention of 'the saltire' takes me back to my childhood days, when we all saw that as the more middle class stuffy thing and the rampant lion was more yer working class symbolism. Not that we waved flags much anyway, only gala days and silly sporting events. Your conflation of what's going on in Scotland with the Gibraltar issue is a bit wrong footed. Even though some Spanish minster is taking a wild stab at it too.
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thesweetcheat 6210 posts |
Apr 02, 2017, 16:52
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sanshee wrote: Any delay to EU negotiations was in part brought about by an unnecessary court case, something remain voters welcomed remember. Hahaha, classic, leavers always trying to find someone else to blame for everything. And it was a court case that was all about Parliament being sovereign, not the government or the PM. I thought you leavers were all about "taking back control" for our Parliament? Oh I'm well aware we haven't left yet. But I still haven't heard anyone - at all - on the leave side explain just what the benefits that we can all expect are, or what laws the EU was preventing us from passing already. Except the "humiliation" of not being able to have a blue passport of course. But now that's sorted it will help create jobs in the Rhondda and Sunderland I'm sure, once we've paid the half a billion quid it will cost us. I'm cheering for the promised sunlit uplands, believe me, I'm making a flag* to wave on the glorious day when we all escape the iniquitous yoke of the evil EU and are free to revel in our new found prosperity while paying £11 6s and thruppence ha-penny for a pound of good old bendy British bananas. I'm busy "getting over it", just waiting for the bounty and good times to come, as promised, along with the money for the NHS. *Probably a St George's cross, I think the union jack will be quite passé by then.
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sanshee 1080 posts |
Edited Apr 02, 2017, 18:14
Apr 02, 2017, 18:09
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I do wish people would look back on Corbyn's long held attitude towards the EU, Corbyn himself more than anyone. And people who *claim* to have supported him and his ideas. All seems very fair weathered now. Never mind. Thankfully Tusk has recognised the importance of sorting out EU citizens rights and the Irish border issue as paramount. Top of his list. Didn't *Theresa Mayhem* ask for that months ago? When these things are sorted out, we all have to be glad about it. I fear *some won't. :( EDIT: *Be glad about it, that is.
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thesweetcheat 6210 posts |
Apr 02, 2017, 18:53
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I have supported Corbyn and his ideas (and still do), although he is failing at putting those ideas across to the electorate and is unlikely to change that any time soon. Labour have already lost Scotland, it looks increasingly as though they will lose many of their seats in England and Wales too. May had the opportunity to put the issue of EU citizens living here beyond doubt before triggering article 50, but chose not to. Tusk has taken the initiative from her, proving himself and the EU to be rather more concerned about the fate of human beings than she and her colleagues are. But I'm sure you're quite right to place your trust in May, Davies, Fox and Johnson to do the right thing by everyone in this country (including Northern Ireland obviously). I would be delighted to be proved wrong about Brexit, but seeing as no-one from leave has yet articulated a single benefit or shown how we will be better off outside the EU I'm not holding my breath. So far they seem to only be bothered about threatening to send the navy to "cripple" Spain (one of our allies, last time I looked) and banging on about how much better blue passports were. And backtracking on every single statement they made in the run up to the referendum. No doubt in the coming weeks and years the leave camp will be setting out in detail how we're all going to be better off. I look forward to it. But here are some things that the EU has confirmed already: *There will be no discussion on trade deals until "sufficient progress" has been made on withdrawal and how much the UK will pay *There will be no avoiding the issue of the border in Ireland *There will be no special sector-specific deals for UK car manufacturing or financial services, whose largest market is the EU It's all about details and facts. Something that leave so far had failed to produce any of. Your friends had better sharpen up fast if we're going to see the promised good times.
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nigelswift 8112 posts |
Apr 02, 2017, 18:54
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"Thankfully Tusk has recognised the importance of sorting out EU citizens rights and the Irish border issue as paramount." Maybe, if the Irish won't sort out the border issue we could threaten war with them as well as Spain. I'm so, so sorry to be in the nation that has turned into the prize knob of Europe.
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sanshee 1080 posts |
Apr 02, 2017, 19:45
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Who has threatened war? Some old irrelevant, frazzled zombie from the Thatcher era? No I don't believe there is a threat of war, that actually horrifies me. But if there was, and if you believe there was, how can you be so casual about it? Does it feel good just to 'say things'?
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