grufty jim
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Edited Aug 12, 2015, 20:57
Re: Alastair Campbell ...
Aug 12, 2015, 20:57
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stray wrote: When are these twats going to realise that they're 'oh noes, the sky will turn red and rain frogs if Corbyn wins' pronouncements are having the complete opposite effect to what they intend. As they're as universally despised by those who will actually be voting as any face on the Tory front bench is.
Blair's at it again. Apparently Labour faces annihilation if Corbyn becomes leader.
Thing is, as I've said already, I actually kind of agree with him. I don't think the New Labour tendency (which - after all - forms the bulk of the Parliamentary Party) can exist within a Corbyn-led party. I watched him on Andrew Marr and came away puzzled (and quite heartened) by just how unashamedly left-wing he really is.
I'm not saying we can expect farm collectivisation to feature in the next Labour manifesto or anything, but he is a long way to the left of Blair and those that followed him. And I don't see them accepting his leadership.
At that point the only real question is whether the split comes in the form of a mass migration of MPs to the Lib Dems (who would probably welcome the colonisation and assimilation with open arms) - or whether they form an official "New Labour Party" - though the costs and logistics of that would far exceed the LibDem colonisation strategy.
What remains of Labour when the right jumps ship might not survive as a significant force in UK politics. Clearly I hope otherwise, but the risk is always there when a movement splits.
Corbyn impressed me more than I expected him to. Which makes me very pessimistic about his chances of mainstream success ;-)
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thesweetcheat
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Re: Alastair Campbell ...
Aug 12, 2015, 22:29
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Blair doesn't seem to realise that every time he opens his mouth he drives more people towards Corbyn and away from the Stepford candidates.
I expect a "sexed up" dossier about how Corbyn is an imminent threat to national security to be appearing any day now.
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stray
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Edited Aug 13, 2015, 07:25
Re: Alastair Campbell ...
Aug 13, 2015, 07:11
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Maybe I'm being over optomistic (likely) but I don't get why there is a consensus that he is unelectable considering the turn out and excitement he's generating at public meetings. Before all this you'ld be lucky to get over 20 people to a meeting (anywhere in the UK) where the politics voiced was this left.
I also dont think there are enough people on the right of the party who are strong enough in their principles now to create a meaningful split. Interestimg and unpredictable times.
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Sanctuary
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Re: Alastair Campbell ...
Aug 13, 2015, 09:40
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stray wrote: Maybe I'm being over optomistic (likely) but I don't get why there is a consensus that he is unelectable considering the turn out and excitement he's generating at public meetings. Before all this you'ld be lucky to get over 20 people to a meeting (anywhere in the UK) where the politics voiced was this left.
I also dont think there are enough people on the right of the party who are strong enough in their principles now to create a meaningful split. Interestimg and unpredictable times.
What will be will be...
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Locodogz
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Re: Alastair Campbell ...
Aug 13, 2015, 10:56
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I have to say that originally bought into the 'Corbyn's a disaster, he'll be unelectable' line as peddled by the PLP and media. However having seen the reaction and support he's received, as well as a few of the interviews he's given I've come around to the view that he'd be a great thing for the party
The prospect of a genuine opposition leader (rather than one trying in essence to agree without sounding like it) at PMQs excites me. I rather doubt he'll ever make PM but the prospect of getting a genuine left-wing agenda (state ownership etc) into a wider mainstream debate/spotlight is a massive opportunity. I'm sure it won't be without pain but the prospect of a Real Labour (as opposed to New Labour) party is worth it. He'll be getting my vote.
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tjj
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Edited Aug 13, 2015, 11:22
Re: Jeremy Corbyn
Aug 13, 2015, 11:20
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I read this piece by that old hippie paper International Times this morning .... they keep the flag flying.
The language is clear and simple, with humour - without being overly abusive to anyone.
http://internationaltimes.it/labour-leadership-battle/
Vote Jeremy! Viva la revolution!
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Rhiannon
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn
Aug 13, 2015, 12:08
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I like that a lot, June, thanks!
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stray
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Mark Steel barred from voting.
Aug 13, 2015, 14:56
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http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-leadership-contest-mark-steel-becomes-latest-leftwinger-to-be-barred-from-voting-10452628.html
and Ken Loach too.
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grufty jim
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Re: Mark Steel barred from voting.
Aug 13, 2015, 22:59
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You have to wonder which terrifies the right wing of the Labour party more... that Corbyn will turn out to be unelectable... or that he might actually win votes.
I do hope your optimism is founded, stray (and others). I do hope he can lead - or at least spark - a resurgence in the left. I have my doubts... but they're the kind I'll enjoy seeing proved wrong.
Here in Ireland mainstream politics has all gone a bit weird. The election is next year and everything is very uncertain at the moment with "Independent / Other" being significantly ahead of any mainstream party in all the polls (who knows what the hell that'll mean in terms of policy; let alone in terms of creating a stable coalition).
Sinn Féin are trying to tap into the basic anti-austerity / left-leaning disillusionment driving people away from the large parties; but they still carry too much historical baggage for a lot of voters. They could go a long way towards addressing that by promoting obvious Leader-in-Waiting Mary Lou McDonald into the top job - but I think Adams still feels the cross-border unity of the party is best served by his continued presence.
All of which is something of an extreme tangent and a discussion for another day.
So er yeah... go Corbyn!! If there's an active drive to exclude potential Corbyn voters from the ballot; he's clearly got the Millbank Machine worried.
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spencer
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Tonights Newsnight
Aug 13, 2015, 23:11
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I assume it'll be on Beeb iPlayer when finished. Second feature is an cringey interview with Yvette Cooper. A l m o s t felt sorry for her, trying to explain why people should vote for her not Corbyn. Look at her eyes, listen to the manic voice on edge of stuttering. Kirsty Wark emphasised she was back in third place, but she refused to back out so Burnham could have her votes. In that case... : D ......and, in the first feature, a West Midlands Labour councillor made the point that Blair had lost FOUR MILLION votes. Wonder why, and how many are thinking of returning to the fold. Add on the young and ethnic minority vote. Crunch the numbers of the last electoral turnout, take into account the boundary changes the Tories brought in. Corbyn unelectable? Er, I think not.
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